Hatch Rawer Beryl Posted October 28, 2013 Author Share Posted October 28, 2013 It's just a ban on an internet site that can be lifted anytime and as you see without too much hassle. I don't really see the problem, you are overreacting and your comparison suck. Perhaps you are right. However, that doesn't change my opinion of bluedemon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Delicious Cashew Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 blue demon has always been one of the worse mods imo my most liked comment on these forums :3 im not funny i know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatOtherChigga #Mack Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Outpost needs more BSODs. outpost needs more zems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Bucket Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Let me ask you this: Is it better to let a guilty man walk free, or to put an innocent man behind bars? If a mod cannot prove beyond reasonable doubt that the user in question is guilty, then the user should not be banned. Are you saying this is a crime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zemnmez Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 For those arguing over whether this was okay, these is the notes I left: Given benefit of doubt, admins would never have accepted evidence produced by the author anyway, ESPECIALLY if it said 'I will close this if it does not sell'. A nice idea, but unworkable all the same. zemnmez Mon 28 Oct 00:55:44 GMT 2013 That's the reason the ban was revoked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roller Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Everyone here makes a mistake... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarZX Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 no one congratulated teeird for getting unbanned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC22 Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 gratz teeird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoDoRiN Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 I know many people (including me) who wouldn't pay attention to the dates the suggestion and comment were made on. You also shouldn't assume that everyone knows as much about backpack.tf as you, because the majority of people don't. He made a mistake, it was corrected, move on. Well the thing was it was Zemnmez that set things straight, not Blue Demon. I added him and waited for 10 minutes-30 minutes throughout the fiasco and never responded to my friend request. He never even responded my appeal: http://puu.sh/51tjd.png So I don't think he would've cared either way. (little bit of an assumption) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professional Map Painter Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 Well the thing was it was Zemnmez that set things straight, not Blue Demon. I added him and waited for 10 minutes-30 minutes throughout the fiasco and never responded to my friend request. He never even responded my appeal: http://puu.sh/51tjd.png So I don't think he would've cared either way. (little bit of an assumption) Well. it's not like he has a track record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
∞Ramses Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 Who cares. A mistake has been made, and now it's solved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarZX Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 What I don't like about BSOD is that he thinks it's right to ban sharks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC22 Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 What I don't like about BSOD is that he thinks it's right to ban sharks.Many other OP admins think that is just as well. It's like a new policy there, fair or otherwise :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Screen of Death Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 What I don't like about BSOD is that he thinks it's right to ban sharks. Main Rules #6: No sharking. Sharking is defined as manipulating another user into trading/selling a valuable item for 10% or less of its accepted value (or 20% or less for users with less than 200 hours in that game). We participate in a network of trading sites that do not tolerate taking advantage of other users for personal gain. It doesn't matter what I think, my job is to enforce the site rules. On a side note, if you could see the finished trades people report to us every day I'm certain you would change your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarZX Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Main Rules #6: No sharking. Sharking is defined as manipulating another user into trading/selling a valuable item for 10% or less of its accepted value (or 20% or less for users with less than 200 hours in that game). We participate in a network of trading sites that do not tolerate taking advantage of other users for personal gain. It doesn't matter what I think, my job is to enforce the site rules. On a side note, if you could see the finished trades people report to us every day I'm certain you would change your mind. What's considered to be an "accepted value"? Backpack.tf prices? So basically we're being dictated by a spreadsheet in a capitalist economy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarZX Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Oh, and, a guy got perma'd for sharking. He bought a Time Warp Antlers or something for another Unusual, neither of them having prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Screen of Death Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 What's considered to be an "accepted value"? Backpack.tf prices? So basically we're being dictated by a spreadsheet in a capitalist economy? Accepted value is market value. Pretty much anyone can find out the range a item is selling for. Backpack.tf is only one of the references. Sharking takes place 99% of the time on trades involving unusuals, and they are usually way higher than 20% off. Oh, and, a guy got perma'd for sharking. He bought a Time Warp Antlers or something for another Unusual, neither of them having prices. I have no recollection of what you are referring to, we handle a lot of reports/cases every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatOtherChigga #Mack Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Oh, and, a guy got perma'd for sharking. He bought a Time Warp Antlers or something for another Unusual, neither of them having prices. Yeah, he paid some crap 3 bud unusual for a 10+ bud unusual. #Sharkmuch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarZX Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Accepted value is market value. Pretty much anyone can find out the range for what a item is selling for. Backpack.tf is only one of the references. Sharking takes place 99% of the time on trades involving unusuals, and they are usually way higher than 20% off. People should be able to sell for what they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Screen of Death Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 People should be able to sell for what they want. Main Rules #6: No sharking. Sharking is defined as manipulating another user into trading/selling a valuable item for 10% or less of its accepted value (or 20% or less for users with less than 200 hours in that game). We participate in a network of trading sites that do not tolerate taking advantage of other users for personal gain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarZX Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 So, if someone just offers someone like a key or something on their Unusual, and the guy accepts, but the guy with the key doesn't say anything like "oh dude this is WAY better than that stupid useless hat with a purple border" or "this is worth more" he can get off scot-free? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Screen of Death Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 So, if someone just offers someone like a key or something on their Unusual, and the guy accepts, but the guy with the key doesn't say anything like "oh dude this is WAY better than that stupid useless hat with a purple border" or "this is worth more" he can get off scot-free? A few questions would be needed here. Why would someone offer a key on an unusual? Maybe because it was recently unboxed and the both were on the same server when it happened... or maybe because one went after someone with low hours/trading experience who owned an unusual and tried to make a quick buck? ... we need to know the exact circumstance. Was it a straight offer without any kind of personal interaction (e.g. a steam trade offer) or not? What knowledge did both sides of the trade had of the all items/values involved? It is never easy to make the call, that's why a lot is required from those in charge. And even trying our best we can still make mistakes. It is also worth to note that we may not be able to get the necessary evidence to issue a ban/confirm the shark, or the evidence we get may be inconclusive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faceman™ Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I said that in the freaking title Yes. Then why the hell are you making such a big deal out of this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatch Rawer Beryl Posted October 30, 2013 Author Share Posted October 30, 2013 Then why the hell are you making such a big deal out of this? Because bluedemon banned him for such a ridiculous reason, and he wasn't even the one to make it right. It was Zemnmez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baloo Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Because bluedemon banned him for such a ridiculous reason, and he wasn't even the one to make it right. It was Zemnmez You may think it is a ridiculous reason because you were dealing with all the facts right from the beginning, however, the first thing ฿LÜΣÃΣMӨП (Bluedemon) saw was a person who appeared to have made a suggestion in the effort to have someone buy all their items for more than the current price. I realize KoDoRiN's response did not look at all serious, but there was a suggestion up doing exactly what the comment asked. We know that the timing of these two events were off, but when you glance at it quickly without taking into account the factor of time, it very much does look like a manipulation attempt. I know some may think it stupid to not have checked the timing of the posts, but Outpost admins and moderators deal with an upwards of thousands of reports daily, and being human, they do make slip-ups. Also price manipulation is a serious issue, and possibly on the level of sharking because you're artificially changing a price of an item for your own personal benefit, and its not just a one time transaction like sharking, if you're successful and you have a stock pile of 50, 100, or even more of that item, then you've made a lot of money because the people that follow backpack.tf are more accepting to pay your higher price. You forget that Hugh Jazz got another user banned from Outpost for trying to manipulate prices: http://www.tf2outpost.com/user/36856 As detailed in the backpack.tf forum thread here: http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/2066-manipulation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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