Liddojunior Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 You must have missed that I used the price of ref, not keys. Also, it does not matter to the seller how the keys were bought does it? Tangent, I would like to know where you think most keys are purchased for cash. According to stats, there are about 6,000 net keys entering the market every week from the mann co store. Obviously keys from sourceops and paypal trades & marketplace and mann co. He listed all prices from those places. And this thread is about how unusuals shouldnt be linked to usd stay on topic i have no idea what you are arguing anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERASER BY Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 You must have missed that I used the price of ref, not keys. Also, it does not matter to the seller how the keys were bought does it? Tangent, I would like to know where you think most keys are purchased for cash. According to stats, there are about 6,000 net keys entering the market every week from the mann co store. The same situation with refs nothing new here. You are contradicting yourself , by saying " Also, it does not matter to the seller how the keys were bought does it? " the same thing about the price of unusual hats - there is a price in the buds and the seller and buyer - do not care how much it costs bud in $ . " Jester, who is going to flock to the website, buyers? Sellers would love a site that shows the price higher on everything. Don't you think buyers would have suspicions about this? " - From this I understand that you do not understand how the site works - how accepted price suggestion and who is interested in this. Website is only concerned with fixing the offers and transactions-it basis suggestion of price , rather than imposing price. A good price suggestion is a statistic , rather than divination. And if you think that the to deceive thousands of people who are watching your suggestion of price and admins is simply - in my experience you're wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Jester, who is going to flock to the website, buyers? Sellers would love a site that shows the price higher on everything. Don't you think buyers would have suspicions about this? Who flocked to backpack.tf from the spreadsheet? Buyers or sellers? or all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC22 Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Speaking of buds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Jester, people come here because they believe it has no agenda and is nonbiased. At first many traders did not like bp.tf. In fact because I used bp.tf early on in my trades I got more business than some. Now it I s a standard so much so that I see unusual traders mentioning that they will accept bp.tf prices as far as offers are concerned in order to gain buyer interest and trust. Sellers may want a new site but do you think that buyers would trust that site if many of its prices were above bp.tf. Hell no. You would only incite anger and distrust from buyers. Eraser, really, thousands of people are watching ur suggestions. Many have less than 100 voters and a majority of them are traders. Of course I understand how the site works, did you not check out my site profile? I have several accepted suggestions, tho none recent. You also missed my point about how the buyer got the keys. Missed it completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liddojunior Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Jester, people come here because they believe it has no agenda and is nonbiased. At first many traders did not like bp.tf. In fact because I used bp.tf early on in my trades I got more business than some. Now it I s a standard so much so that I see unusual traders mentioning that they will accept bp.tf prices as far as offers are concerned in order to gain buyer interest and trust. Sellers may want a new site but do you think that buyers would trust that site if many of its prices were above bp.tf. Hell no. You would only incite anger and distrust from buyers. Eraser, really, thousands of people are watching ur suggestions. Many have less than 100 voters and a majority of them are traders. Of course I understand how the site works, did you not check out my site profile? I have several accepted suggestions, tho none recent. You also missed my point about how the buyer got the keys. Missed it completely. I dont think you fully understand the problem. The unusuals are being converted with the wrong cost of keys and buds. Unusuals priced when buds and keys were listed as $1.75-1.80 and $40 are shown wrong because keys are 1.90 and buds are 46 If there was a site that had the exact same $$ value as the ones listed here. The prices will be "higher" because of the correct conversion cost and people can not deny it (especially dis trust it) if they are the same $$ cost and being converted with the correct $$ of keys/buds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERASER BY Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Eraser, really, thousands of people are watching ur suggestions. Many have less than 100 voters and a majority of them are traders. Of course I understand how the site works, did you not check out my site profile? I have several accepted suggestions, tho none recent. You also missed my point about how the buyer got the keys. Missed it completely. "You also missed my point about how the buyer got the keys. Missed it completely." I do not see special sense in it, but if you so wish. Do you mean that if you bought the keys to the store Man co for 2.5 $, but not at the price of 1.7-1.8, at the outpost, the seller of unusual hats must sell you a hat with 30% discount? Price key in store Man co -2.5 $ .All keys on the market from the store Steam, is not it? But you probably do not know that a very large amount of keys (I do not know the exact numbers now, about a year ago, it was> 50%) store-bought Steam, were bought with stolen bank cards( ie the price for the key 0,00 $ ) most of the keys not disappear, they are present in the market. From this we obtain a prices 1.3-1.8 $ for key. For this reason, your mathematical calculations is not are true . But that's not the main thing, the main thing I repeat "Then and now buyers are willing to pay the same price in the keys- buds. It does not matter that the price of the bud has increased in $ , 90% of transactions happening in the keys and buds and not for real money " - Jester has proved it in our examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 I do not see special sense in it, but if you so wish. Do you mean that if you bought the keys to the store Man co for 2.5 $, but not at the price of 1.7-1.8, at the outpost, the seller of unusual hats must sell you a hat with 30% discount? I meant that the seller only cares that he is getting paid in current pure. But that's not the main thing, the main thing I repeat "Then and now buyers are willing to pay the same price in the keys- buds. It does not matter that the price of the bud has increased in $ , 90% of transactions happening in the keys and buds and not for real money " - Jester has proved it in our examples. Again, I mean the trade price of a bud. Examples: 1. Retrader buys hat at 2 buds when buds r 27 keys, lists he will sell for 2.4 buds intending on a 20% profit Trade price of buds drops to 22 keys. If he sells at the 2.4 bud price he lost 2~ keys in the transaction, : { 2. Retrader buys hat at 2 buds when buds r 22 keys, lists at 2.4 buds intending on same profit of 20%. Trade price of bud rises to 25 keys. If successful, seller receives unintended profit of 16% additional ; } but buyer got hosed : { even if he didn't realize it at first. They also have a hat worth less depending how other buyer see's it. I am sure sellers adjusted price of unusual sales when buds were lower but now ur trying to legitimize an undo increase. If buyers have been brainwashed into believing bp.tf prices are wrong because of a programing issue then that is also unfair of you to do. I hope this helps you understand what I am saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 I dont think you fully understand the problem. The unusuals are being converted with the wrong cost of keys and buds. Unusuals priced when buds and keys were listed as $1.75-1.80 and $40 are shown wrong because keys are 1.90 and buds are 46 If there was a site that had the exact same $$ value as the ones listed here. The prices will be "higher" because of the correct conversion cost and people can not deny it (especially dis trust it) if they are the same $$ cost and being converted with the correct $$ of keys/buds Again, you miss the point that the currency you are receiving has more buying power today than before when the item was last suggested and accepted. These currencies don't just buy unusuals you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liddojunior Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Again, you miss the point that the currency you are receiving has more buying power today than before when the item was last suggested and accepted. These currencies don't just buy unusuals you know. Can you not wrap your head around the fact buds are not 46$ and there is a wrong conversion because of that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 I am sure sellers adjusted price of unusual sales when buds were lower but now ur trying to legitimize an undo increase.Sellers don't adjust their prices due to the temporary crash. It happened last year at the same time. Most believe that a bud is a bud and in USD they haven't lost value, it's just that the key conversion fluctuates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Sellers don't adjust their prices due to the temporary crash. It happened last year at the same time. Most believe that a bud is a bud and in USD they haven't lost value, it's just that the key conversion fluctuates. Its foolish to think that. Also, note that the bud has not recovered to the near 28 key high it was at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liddojunior Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Its foolish to think that. Also, note that the bud has not recovered to the near 28 key high it was at. Who cares if they havnt gone to 28 keys they have increased in $$ from the $30 they were Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swag Inc Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 And if you bought an unusual with refined, it should remain priced in refined. Indexing on the currency used seems the most rational approach. Do you index the price of an american house on the yen ? Then why would a bud be index on dollar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuffRyders Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 And if you bought an unusual with refined, it should remain priced in refined. Indexing on the currency used seems the most rational approach. Do you index the price of an american house on the yen ? Then why would a bud be index on dollar? What? Nobody buys unusuals with refined Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC22 Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 There was a nnb mullet once with a b/o of 60 refined or 17 keys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 What? Nobody buys unusuals with refined When keys were stable at 2.33, ref was used if someone didn't have enough. That's what I've heard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Who cares if they havnt gone to 28 keys they have increased in $$ from the $30 they were Liddo, I was refering to jesyer's point that traders wouldn't charge more when buds were droping because they knew it would go back up. If everyone knew the price would rebound why did it go down. Of course sellers priced them higher. If they spent 54 keys in buds (when buds were 27) to get an unusual they will not sell it for 2.4 buds when buds r 21 keys (sale worth 50 keys). Cmon, is that what you and jester r trying to say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Liddo, I was refering to jesyer's point that traders wouldn't charge more when buds were droping because they knew it would go back up. If everyone knew the price would rebound why did it go down. Of course sellers priced them higher. If they spent 54 keys in buds (when buds were 27) to get an unusual they will not sell it for 2.4 buds when buds r 21 keys (sale worth 50 keys). Cmon, is that what you and jester r trying to say?Buds always go down when there is a demand for keys but the value bounces back b/c no one wants to store 250 keys in their BP so they store wealth in buds. Another reason they increase back up is b/c there are a lot of bud bankers. These bankers cause inflation but luckily the unboxing events create a demand for keys so the price of buds in keys gets deflated. Most unusual traders don't care about the key/bud conversion other than when calculating fractions of a bud. 3 bud hats were 3 bud hats throughout the whole dip and current rise. To the typical unusual trader that deals is hats that are more than 2 buds, if they bought and sold a hat for 2 buds then there was nothing gained or lost. Your example applies to the gutter unusual market where people are changing buds for keys to buy/sell hats. Believe me when you are trading 9-10 bud hats you don't convert the buds to keys and figure out how many equivalent keys has been exchanged. It's "well i bought that one for 7.5 pure and sold it for 9 pure". Also, the USD price of buds has steadily increased. Ultimately i think a lot of traders think of cashing out so as long as buds are going up they are making $$ on the investment. So turning 3 buds into 4 will continue to be profitable unless the USD price of buds starts to fall. Regardless of the bud/key exchange rate. P.S. This conversation is wayyyyy off topic. If you want to discuss it further it should be moved to the economy section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liddojunior Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 P.S. This conversation is wayyyyy off topic. If you want to discuss it further it should be moved to the economy section. Its soo off topic i dont even know what charlie is trying to state Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christley </3 Peelz Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 http://backpack.tf/vote/id/51bf345d4bd7b85474000009 here is a very good example why it needs to be in buds. buds price didnt change. the suggestion was up 1-2 days. by that time, it dropped 1.2 buds. without reason to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 http://backpack.tf/vote/id/51bf345d4bd7b85474000009 here is a very good example why it neertds to be in buds. buds price didnt change. the suggestion was up 1-2 days. by that time, it dropped 1.2 buds. without reason to This is a great example of why the mod needs to be able to change the suggestion cuurency before accepting. It does not have anythiing to do with my dispute with changing the price to buds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christley </3 Peelz Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 This is a great example of why the mod needs to be able to change the suggestion cuurency before accepting. It does not have anythiing to do with my dispute with changing the price to buds. not everything is about you. i was talking about the suggestion. not how you're against it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F CHARLIE Posted June 21, 2013 Share Posted June 21, 2013 not everything is about you. i was talking about the suggestion. not how you're against it I know its not about me and note I agreed with u in a way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polar Posted June 21, 2013 Author Share Posted June 21, 2013 Its soo off topic i dont even know what charlie is trying to state Agreed. Guys, I don't even know what this discussion is about any more. Charlie, I'm not sure how many unusuals you have priced on this site. But for 90% of unusuals that I have updated even over the course of 6 months-9 months since their last suggestion, their value has remained remarkably consistent in BUDS and NOT USD. In fact, I have made multiple suggestions on the same hats and every time I suggest it's for the SAME VALUE IN BUDS that keeps dropping due to change in currency. And this is supported by actual sales in pure buds for the same number of buds even 3-6 months apart. Yes, some hats are depreciating but that is independent of the currency change. They are depreciating due to the effects, particularly the commonplace weather ones, and those effects will need to be dropped. But the VAST majority of unusuals have maintained virtually the exact same value in buds or keys over months. And just as many are actually rising with respect to buds and keys (logo effects, fettis, high tier stuff) compared to those dropping (weather, nnb, steaming/smoking). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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