ThunderClaus Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 Another suggestion: http://backpack.tf/vote/id/512e53944bd7b87335000010 These duped items are really a special case it seems and I think we should base the price on duped ones if there are i.e. 10 dupes vs 1 clean. Any other thoughts for this? duped value: clean value: so that way, people will know what a clean vintage earbud goes for, and what a duped one. that seems to be the easiest fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderClaus Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 For vintages this is true but what about unusuals? There are some buds difference between a clean and a duped burning modest/anger for example and there are more duped modests on the market than clean ones for example. we are talking about high tier items (over 20 earbuds) dropping down 5-10 buds in value. it CAN apply to unusuals, and certainly does. but "rare" vintages are the most "unorganized" ones right now when it comes to pricing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderClaus Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 How does one dupe a hat? Is it impossible now? nope, still happening till today. now its mostly done via steam support from "tricksters" like og. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderClaus Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 I thought people stopped caring if an item is duped or not. And only certain people will pay more for clean items. nope, especially when it comes to god tier items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woifi The Viking Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 most dupes are from duplicators like og. small percent are actual real hijacking issues. I know, but it gets technically duped by steam support, that's what I meant. duped value: clean value: so that way, people will know what a clean vintage earbud goes for, and what a duped one. that seems to be the easiest fix. Yeaht that was brought up before. If it is easily possible, that will be the best I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Killjoy Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Dude, you can put several quotes into just one message. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AwesomeMcCoolName Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 I personally think that VALVe should fix this shit, and when they restore items they should get their own brand new ID. This item duplication makes it hard to track owners of items because say, 1 earbud that's been duped 20 times has 20x bigger owner history. I don't think backpack.tf should facilitate the valuation of duped items. I think duped items is something outside of the market and it should stay that way. If people are willing to buy duped items at a lower cost, it's their own decision (like my sparkle lugermorph) -- but in the end, I just VALVe would deal with this and resolve this issue once for all. O... how i wish valve would clean ALL dupes.... such a pain in the ass to track down who a bud was traded to when there are 30 owners btwn the 2 im looking for... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjjon123 Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 I cannot speak for Mr. Bucket and his actions but whatever vintage promos I have accepted, I have looked at clean sales only (with the exception of a big kill suggestion I once downgraded slightly). All others I have denied based off of dupes. Again, Mr. bucket did his own thing with the v. lid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Distinctively Vincent Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Could I get a clarification on the situation with og? I've heard about him being brought up in another suggestion, but it's the first I've heard of him. Any details on who he is and what he's been doing exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AwesomeMcCoolName Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Well, Og happened to be a vintage collector.... ^^Thats about all i know... Based on the way you phrased that question (with a negative connotation , i'm going to guess he's either been manipulating rare vintage prices or he's been involved in their duping... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNC Phoenix® Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 The mass majority (i mean literally 90%+) of duped items are from steam support- yes. but dupers like og are the ones doing it. not "people who get scammed" because valve doesnt care for scammers. now hijacked items.. thats another thing and they do restore (but dupers trick valve into doing it for them) so i understand your point, but its only concerning a small percent of the many dupes out there. duped value: clean value: so that way, people will know what a clean vintage earbud goes for, and what a duped one. that seems to be the easiest fix. I see reports on forums everyday of players claiming to lost their accounts to "hackers", wether it is legit or not I dont know. What I do know is that they would get affected by your suggestion. Again it comes down to this, what is the difference between a duped vintage flaregun and a clean vintage flaregun? The only difference is its ID number. It is like I wrote above, Valve doesnt make a difference so why should we? Or like Brad Pitt wrote, pricing of items on backpack.tf should be on the item itself as far as possible. If one guy can show you can get 200 vintage flaregun for a scrap and they are all duped, doesnt mean they dont count just because one guy can produce ONE clean vintage flaregun that goes for 10 keys. IF you are COLLECTOR and you want all your items to have unique id numbers, then I can understand the importance of clean items. But again, these collectors live in their own world and they value items very different from the majority. I would never pay buds for a collection of vintage bonk level 1-100 but some would. Same as I would never pay extra for an item that has level 100 or level 1, but some would. Your suggestion about having a clean value and duped value. I can bet that if you enforce that, everybody will all of a sudden claim having clean items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Killjoy Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Your suggestion about having a clean value and duped value. I can bet that if you enforce that, everybody will all of a sudden claim having clean items. People already do that though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woifi The Viking Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Could I get a clarification on the situation with og? I've heard about him being brought up in another suggestion, but it's the first I've heard of him. Any details on who he is and what he's been doing exactly? From what I heared he is a hijacker, scammer and a mass duper with many alts. Most items like burning hazmat, burning bonk boy, secret team cpt and the vintages are all duped by him it seems. I guess he hijackes his own alts to dupe the items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
☣Long218☢ Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 From what I heared he is a hijacker, scammer and a mass duper with many alts. Most items like burning hazmat, burning bonk boy, secret team cpt and the vintages are all duped by him it seems. I guess he hijackes his own alts to dupe the items. http://backpack.tf/id/76561198024328220?time=1359446400 all of those unusuals are duped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNC Phoenix® Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 http://backpack.tf/item/1197054625 Above is a perfect example of how the softwara can fail to find duped hats. If you check the current owner, then compare with the list of owners below. Notice that the current owner is actually not the latest owner. But the hat is not marked as duped or anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderClaus Posted February 28, 2013 Author Share Posted February 28, 2013 Phoenix, I see reports on forums everyday of players claiming to lost their accounts to "hackers", wether it is legit or not I dont know. What I do know is that they would get affected by your suggestion. Again it comes down to this, what is the difference between a duped vintage flaregun and a clean vintage flaregun? The only difference is its ID number. It is like I wrote above, Valve doesnt make a difference so why should we? Or like Brad Pitt wrote, pricing of items on backpack.tf should be on the item itself as far as possible. If one guy can show you can get 200 vintage flaregun for a scrap and they are all duped, doesnt mean they dont count just because one guy can produce ONE clean vintage flaregun that goes for 10 keys. IF you are COLLECTOR and you want all your items to have unique id numbers, then I can understand the importance of clean items. But again, these collectors live in their own world and they value items very different from the majority. I would never pay buds for a collection of vintage bonk level 1-100 but some would. Same as I would never pay extra for an item that has level 100 or level 1, but some would. Your suggestion about having a clean value and duped value. I can bet that if you enforce that, everybody will all of a sudden claim having clean items. Phenoix, the majority of duped items are from hijackers duping it themselves, a very few amount comes from innocent people. If a innocent person is concerned about having the value of their stolen items reduced when a hijacker steals their item, then they should be more careful and not get hijacked in the first place.. its really not that hard. have 2 passwrods, that are very difficult to remember. one for your steam acc, one for your email. activate your steam gaurd, and have it so inorder to sign on your email, you need to input a code that they send to you via text message. Also, there is a HUGE difference between clean and duped items. Besides "sharing the same id" its supply. Idk if you know anything about economy and how it works, but its all supply vs demand. When items get mass duped, demand for them goes down, and supply goes up. This makes it so less people want the item, and more people are trying to sell the item, driving the price WAY down. Its much bigger then just "same id number" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderClaus Posted February 28, 2013 Author Share Posted February 28, 2013 http://backpack.tf/item/1197054625 Above is a perfect example of how the softwara can fail to find duped hats. If you check the current owner, then compare with the list of owners below. Notice that the current owner is actually not the latest owner. But the hat is not marked as duped or anything. The software "doesnt fail" to find duped hats. The software logs EVERYTIME a profile is observed when using the website (tf2items/uhatsearch/bp.tfsearch) duped items are first of all in private bagpacks (of scammer alts) so its impossible for the website to pull up their inventorys, thus it cant log the items, and second of all try this link: http://www.tf2items.com/item/1405458584 it is duped atleast 9 times. People on buyout are selling "dirty" ones for 30 (http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8714347), and one guy has a clean one thats hes trying to sell for 35 (http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8878391) . To say "its just a the same id" is a excuse. More supply, less demand and proven with the links above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderClaus Posted February 28, 2013 Author Share Posted February 28, 2013 Anyway, i dont like the direction this thread is going. It seems a debate about the way one views a duped hat is going to be brought up. This threads purpose is to bring to admins attention that duped high tier items need to either be treated all equallly with clean ones (price suggestion wise) or be treated as a separate item, with a seperate price then a clean ones. The current system is some vintage's new price suggestions get passed because buyouts on outpost are low for duped hats. Yet some dont because admins claim duped items prices dont matter, only clean do. Its a big mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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