Just call me Joe Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Well, it's hard to really say. I'm atheist because just don't understand it and I have no issue with any religion I feel if we are all the same even if we have different ideas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teh Betmon Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 That is completely wrong.. who said that people will be judged in groups ? who said that all muslims are going to heaven ? why there is reward and punishment in the atheism row when they don't believe in them ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teh Betmon Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Why religious people have problems with atheists ? Maybe because they're making fun of their most sacred things e.g calling jesus cheesus.. using the name god to describe how overpowered is something.. heaven\hell jokes.. etc... How are you not expecting such hate and angry reactions from them after all that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teh Betmon Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 It is a policy of Islam to convert by the sword. Not really.. prophet muhammed fought the bigoted kings that refused to let him publish the message of god to people.. and no he did not attack them directly he initially sent them messages to allow him to do what he needed.. yes that means osama bin laden was wrong when he attacked the us.. he thought that all non-muslim should be fought.. that's wrong because as long as you can talk and discuss your religion and you're even allowed to build mosques(places of worship) in their country there is absolutely no reason to start wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splat Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 That is completely wrong.. who said that people will be judged in groups ? who said that all muslims are going to heaven ? why there is reward and punishment in the atheism row when they don't believe in them ? See where it says "Good Deeds Rewarded". Besides, you do realise that since this is working off of statistics that if you add an additional "Good Muslim"/"Bad Muslim" it only makes the chances slimmer. Why religious people have problems with atheists ? Maybe because they're making fun of their most sacred things e.g calling jesus cheesus.. using the name god to describe how overpowered is something.. heaven\hell jokes.. etc... How are you not expecting such hate and angry reactions from them after all that ? Believers do that too, surely you should hate them because some of them do it like the atheists do? Not really.. prophet muhammed fought the bigoted kings that refused to let him publish the message of god to people.. and no he did not attack them directly he initially sent them messages to allow him to do what he needed.. yes that means osama bin laden was wrong when he attacked the us.. he thought that all non-muslim should be fought.. that's wrong because as long as you can talk and discuss your religion and you're even allowed to build mosques(places of worship) in their country there is absolutely no reason to start wars. You must recall that it is a crime against Islam to convert to another religion? Although, a Google search has shown that it is a myth that conversion by the sword was widespread. Point redacted - other than the aforementioned sentence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teh Betmon Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 See where it says "Good Deeds Rewarded". Besides, you do realise that since this is working off of statistics that if you add an additional "Good Muslim"/"Bad Muslim" it only makes the chances slimmer. it also says in the "bad deeds rewarded" that they're gonna have "reward".. if they believe what they're doing is wrong why would they get rewarded for it ? Believers do that too, surely you should hate them because some of them do it like the atheists do? And what do atheists have to be made fun of ?.. surely there is that kind of people in both religious and atheists side but religious are obviously fewer. You must recall that it is a crime against Islam to convert to another religion? Although, a Google search has shown that it is a myth that conversion by the sword was widespread. Point redacted - other than the aforementioned sentence. its not a crime because they never fought innocent people.. 'nuff said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee_Jay007 ♥ Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Why religious people have problems with atheists ? Maybe because they're making fun of their most sacred things e.g calling jesus cheesus.. using the name god to describe how overpowered is something.. heaven\hell jokes.. etc... How are you not expecting such hate and angry reactions from them after all that ? I can say I'm a religious person and I would never appreciate someone mocking my beliefs like this guy with this post said. But I'm fine with anyone with/without any beliefs. We are all humans after all. We can make our own choices. I'm not your God and you're not my God, and we're free to do anything we want as long as it's not against the rights of others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heated Bread Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I can say I'm a religious person and I would never appreciate someone mocking my beliefs like this guy with this post said. But I'm fine with anyone with/without any beliefs. We are all humans after all. We can make our own choices. I'm not your God and you're not my God, and we're free to do anything we want as long as it's not against the rights of others. I don't condone being an asshole to others, and it strikes me that the kind of mockery you're thinking about would border on or cross the line into that territory (even though the examples given by teh betmon were actually very mild and makes him look to me like he has a persecution complex). But at the same time, you have to realize that we do live in an era where anyone can find out nearly any piece of information that they want. It's called the information age. In such an era of freely flowing information, your religion can make you look increasingly out of touch with the times. This is because it can cause you to place blind faith above facts, and instead of letting a logical evaluation of the evidence lead you to conclusions based on that evidence, you may prefer to start with a conclusion based on your faith and then try to look for evidence which will fit that conclusion. But it's worse than that. The religious conclusions that you are tempted to use as your starting points can appear ridiculous to outsiders, so it should be no surprise when you receive ridicule. Again, I don't condone being an asshole to people, I'm just saying that it shouldn't be so surprising when it happens. I also want to note that while might make it seem like the spirit of the age is one that prizes knowledge, the reality is that (at least in the U.S. and Canada), the religious are still in the majority and have most of the political power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splat Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I'm not going to respond to any of Teh Batmon's arguments since none of them make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 I understand that many Athiests have problems with certain aspects of religion. I certainly do. However I also have problems with Athiests (which includes me). So I'm asking what problems religious people have with us and what we do. Not all atheists people religious people have problems with. Just ones that make fun of those that believe in religions and say they are wrong, there is no god and you use religion to believe you will go to a different place once you die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VacheMax Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 here's one of the reasons why I don't believe in a god btw... the "finite loss" is not worth the tiny chance of a pleasant life after death. Sorry to nitpick, but as a Mormon, we believe everyone will go to heaven. Some will just be closer to Heavenly Father than others. There are a select few that we believe will be sent to purgatory. So even those with bad deeds will go heaven, dependent of certain things. Also, I'm supposing the "punishment" is the judging phase, since we all have that. Even Mormons do, because I can tell you, there are NO perfect people. Lots of Mormon aren't acting Mormon. So yeah. I also think this graph is rather generalizing, but it'd be hard not to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Sorry to nitpick, but as a Mormon, we believe everyone will go to heaven. Some will just be closer to Heavenly Father than others. There are a select few that we believe will be sent to purgatory. So even those with bad deeds will go heaven, dependent of certain things. Also, I'm supposing the "punishment" is the judging phase, since we all have that. Even Mormons do, because I can tell you, there are NO perfect people. Lots of Mormon aren't acting Mormon. So yeah. I also think this graph is rather generalizing, but it'd be hard not to be. I used to go to the Church of Latterday Saints but now I just pray at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilDEATH1234 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Well, it is a direct assault on personal beliefs, which has a tendency to create immediate conflict. That could be called the "surface conflict" for the conflict, but as the conflict continues, it becomes hypocrisy of action and uncertainty. A popular claim against religion is indoctrination by church, but school indoctrinates as well. Be raised by religion, aspire to be like Pope Francis, the epitome of Christian religion, be raised by school, aspire to be Stephen Hawking, claiming that "it's all a fairytale" in comparison. Its indoctrination on both sides. Or possibly, religion causes wars. Its only a factor, and as far as history goes, shady government ops. have cause a fair number of wars too. Atheists claim religious people follow blindly by their rules, but in the end, they follow what they are told as well. Examples being Christians follow the Bible as the mandate, while the source is subjugated to flaws, but Atheists follow whatever theory a man of science has presented as mandate, claiming it has undeniable proof, based on the logic of the material world. Logic is a fundamentally flawed concept, assuming humans are all knowing of the laws of the universe based on a few observations of what is the universe. Perhaps humans can only conceive of so much, we are all so limited after all. Information is only as free as the government wants it to be, and so are we. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heated Bread Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Well, it is a direct assault on personal beliefs, which has a tendency to create immediate conflict. That could be called the "surface conflict" for the conflict, but as the conflict continues, it becomes hypocrisy of action and uncertainty. A popular claim against religion is indoctrination by church, but school indoctrinates as well. Be raised by religion, aspire to be like Pope Francis, the epitome of Christian religion, be raised by school, aspire to be Stephen Hawking, claiming that "it's all a fairytale" in comparison. Its indoctrination on both sides. Or possibly, religion causes wars. Its only a factor, and as far as history goes, shady government ops. have cause a fair number of wars too. Atheists claim religious people follow blindly by their rules, but in the end, they follow what they are told as well. Examples being Christians follow the Bible as the mandate, while the source is subjugated to flaws, but Atheists follow whatever theory a man of science has presented as mandate, claiming it has undeniable proof, based on the logic of the material world. Logic is a fundamentally flawed concept, assuming humans are all knowing of the laws of the universe based on a few observations of what is the universe. Perhaps humans can only conceive of so much, we are all so limited after all. Information is only as free as the government wants it to be, and so are we. No offense, but it sounds almost like you've never heard of skepticism before. Who in their right mind could ever say that someone who is rejecting an unsupported claim (an atheist rejecting a god claim) is following something on blind faith? I think you've probably been reading too many of teh betmon's posts. You're apparently assuming that atheists are blindly following scientific and governmental authority. Skepticism is about doubting things which do not have sufficient evidence. If you think we're all just at the mercy of accepting things we're told, then clearly you do not understand that people can be skeptical and attempt to evaluate evidence on their own. Just because some people are unwilling to do that doesn't mean everyone is. Maybe you should practice being skeptical about things and then you might begin to understand how others can do this as well, if not better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilDEATH1234 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Supported is in the eye of the beholder, as is amount of evidence. Skepticism about the spectrum of theism and atheism is what propelled my current view of the scenario, being skeptical of both sides of the argument seems to give a clearer answer to a scientifically minded individual, in my opinion, of course. Being skeptical of only one side is not a proper way to gain knowledge and effectively debate on the subject. Atheists and society as a whole are subjugated to following the science of what they want to hear as truth, and dismissing science they don't want to hear as false, the same is true with religious people when regarding scripture. People are inherently supportive of their views and dismissive of other views, and will attempt to further their views and disprove other views by any means possible. Only true skeptics will trace the entirety of the scientific progression to look for inconsistencies, but most, including myself, see a logical progression of science and regard the majority as truth and would rather look towards applicable scientific theory when examining the argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heated Bread Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Atheists and society as a whole are subjugated to following the science of what they want to hear as truth, and dismissing science they don't want to hear as false, the same is true with religious people when regarding scripture. Any scientist worth their salt will tell you that this is not how things actually work. The theories that gain acceptance are the ones that best fit the data, not the ones that people like the most. Quantum theory is a great general example. It is not and has never been a popular theory in the sense that it is very much disliked due to the difficulty of understanding it since it does not fit with the common sense every day human experience, and it is not understood well even by the most accomplished and noted theoretical physicists, and yet it is still accepted within the body of science because it offers the best predictive and explanatory power. Science is not about what you or anyone else wants to hear, it is about discovering to the best of our abilities what reality is on reality's terms. So as someone who understands this, I can tell you that I am most certainly not cherry picking the stuff I like and throwing out the stuff that I don't. In order to do that, I would have to lack a basic understanding of what science is about. The fact that you would think to make a comparison to cherry picking scriptures shows that you may not have that understanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splat Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 This thread is a train wreck. I give up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splat Posted August 2, 2014 Share Posted August 2, 2014 This thread is a train wreck. I give up. Actually, you know what, this whole forum is a train wreck. I think I'll just lurk in future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimes Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Actually, you know what, this whole forum is a train wreck. I think I'll just lurk in future. There's no fun in that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The O'mighty Ham Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Im a person who is accepting of religions but personally not convinced by it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splat Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 There's no fun in that. I guess you're right. Besides, generally it's the people in it whom I disapprove of. If you don't want to be criticised because of your beliefs then that means you're insecure. The only argument I steer clear from is that that makes no sense. The fact is, as I've said, if you don't want to be criticised you are INSECURE. Not self-protective or shy, INSECURE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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