Blue Star Test

[Jymotion]

Figured this would be a good place to discuss the topic of how rep may influence voting outcomes.  Specifically referencing this recent "test" to see if Hugh Jazz could get a bad suggestion passed.  It was inevitably tainted and inconclusive, so we don't need to discuss that particular event, but I think the discussion should be had.

• Do users with high rep have a heightened influence on the listed prices of bp.tf?
• If they don't, is it a possible threat in the future?
• Even if it isn't, is the perception that they do a concern?  (people no longer trusting the site)
   
• Is "rep" good or bad for the site?  Does it encourage people to contribute or does it encourage them to vote for which they think will win?

I'm trying to keep this initial post as unbiased as possible.  If you have an issue with it, or a discussion question to add, let me know.  If this discussion is more fitted for another board, (mods) feel free to move it, if possible.

 

edit: locked due to very little relevant discussion

[MC22]

I'm not sure why you users feel the need to play all these little games with each other, or pretend to be social scientists just so you can win a trivial argument. Especially considering it's been done before many many times. All you're doing is wasting everyone's time. -cleverpun

This.

Obviously, there are enough people out there to tell that a suggestion sucks, let alone the mods, who take a look themselves for every single suggestion. I doubt rep is what gets stuff passed, but it does get one upvotes.

[Jymotion]

I'm not sure why you users feel the need to play all these little games with each other, or pretend to be social scientists just so you can win a trivial argument. Especially considering it's been done before many many times. All you're doing is wasting everyone's time.

 

quote from cleverpun, for those who don't click the link.

 

I doubt rep is what gets stuff passed, but it does get one upvotes.

 

which could cause people to say "the votes don't matter" and its reputation as a community-based price list could be questioned

[MC22]

DoubleOme has copied Hugh Jazz exactly.

[Jymotion]

DoubleOme has copied Hugh Jazz exactly.

 

that was the second part of the experiment.  said they would compare up/down ratios.  they seem to be completely ignoring the major experimental integrity issues in doing that.

 

just to reiterate: I don't intend for this to stir up drama or anything.  Just looking to discuss some of the questions I posed.

[☣Long218☢]

Not this again.

[Jymotion]

Not this again.

 

has this been discussed here?  specifically the questions I asked?  did you read the post at all?

[cleverpun]

This wasn't a test or an experiment, it was just the latest in a long line of poorly planned stunts.

 

Here's the last one; http://steamcommunity.com/groups/meetthestats/discussions/1/864959810036702621/

[Jymotion]

This wasn't a test or an experiment, it was just the latest in a long line of poorly-planned stunts.

 

Here's the last one; http://steamcommunity.com/groups/meetthestats/discussions/1/864959810036702621/

 

why does no one read the full post :/

[AwesomeMcCoolName]

why does no one read the full post :/

We're on the internet, who reads? 

[☣Long218☢]

We're on the internet, who reads? 

no one

[cleverpun]

why does no one read the full post :/

 

I did read it, but A.) everything here has been covered already and B.) as an objective observer it's obvious to me that suggester accomplishments do not have enough influence on the price list to be a significant problem.

 

I've taken enough college courses on hard science to know that bias is inevitable anywhere--it's a question of whether it taints the result or not, and I don't see that on bp.tf.

 

I'm a mod and I don't get a free pass, which to me is a very good sign; http://backpack.tf/vote/id/512d029f4bd7b89b47000001

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/510c5997ba25366868000002

[Jymotion]

as an objective observer it's obvious to me that suggester accomplishments do not have enough influence on the price list to be a significant problem.

 

I've taken enough college courses on hard science to know that bias is inevitable anywhere--it's a question of whether it taints the result or not, and I don't see that on bp.tf.

 

I don't doubt that at all, but is there any concern about the growing opinion that the site will accept anything with a blue star next to it?  Regardless of whether it is true or not, public opinion should be considered.

[☣Long218☢]

I did read it, but A.) everything here has been covered already and B.) as an objective observer it's obvious to me that suggester accomplishments do not have enough influence on the price list to be a significant problem.

 

I've taken enough college courses on hard science to know that bias is inevitable anywhere--it's a question of whether it taints the result or not, and I don't see that on bp.tf.

 

I'm a mod and I don't get a free pass, which to me is a very good sign; http://backpack.tf/vote/id/512d029f4bd7b89b47000001http://backpack.tf/vote/id/510c5997ba25366868000002

. Check out brad suggestions :/ he just tell a mod to accept them without proof

[cranwell96]

I don't doubt that at all, but is there any concern about the growing opinion that the site will accept anything with a blue star next to it?  Regardless of whether it is true or not, public opinion should be considered.

 

The mods are there for a reason, to check whether the voters are actually right. They won't just accept a suggestion without verifying it first.

Example: Long accidentally made the experiment 2 days ago: http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513b2dbe4bd7b85c0f000007 His proof did not match the suggestion, and his evaluation of the offer was off by a lot. The votes: 55 upvotes, 8 downvotes. Was it accepted: No, shenanigans informed Long of his mistake and he remade the suggestion correctly.

[cleverpun]

I don't doubt that at all, but is there any concern about the growing opinion that the site will accept anything with a blue star next to it?  Regardless of whether it is true or not, public opinion should be considered.

 

Public opinion is very important, but some people are going to find any excuse to hate the site no matter what. You have to pick your battles: most regular users know about the large emphasis put on proof already.

 

You are, of course, free to retread the issue, and perhaps you'll reach new conclusions that will help improve the site. Considering how this thread started, however, I don't see enough differences from the previous debates to reach meaningfully different conclusions.

 

Check out brad suggestions :/ he just tell a mod to accept them without proof

 

Been discussed already; http://steamcommunity.com/groups/meetthestats/discussions/0/846938350735859730

[Jymotion]

Public opinion is very important, but some people are going to find any excuse to hate the site no matter what. You have to pick your battles: most regular users know about the large emphasis put on proof already.

 

true.  i guess my concern stemmed from the fact that the comments hating on the site are being upvoted to the top of some suggestions (uncrafts, keys)

[jjjon123]

I dont believe having lots of rep affects anything other than the quantity of upvotes on a good suggestion.

 

What has more say is how you present the proof, for example, the following suggestion has nice outlined proof but it only takes 5 seconds of clicking on the link to find out it is wrong. But it has a 75% upvote and a mod even upvoted it.

 

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513bb9044bd7b8e217000006

 

The notes have more impact than who you are, from what Ive seen.

[Jymotion]

The notes have more impact than who you are, from what Ive seen.

 

A good point that I hadn't even thought to consider.  That's pretty inherent in the voters and certainly not something that can be addressed.

[MC22]

I dont believe having lots of rep affects anything other than the quantity of upvotes on a good suggestion.

 

What has more say is how you present the proof, for example, the following suggestion has nice outlined proof but it only takes 5 seconds of clicking on the link to find out it is wrong. But it has a 75% upvote and a mod even upvoted it.

 

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513bb9044bd7b8e217000006

 

The notes have more impact than who you are, from what Ive seen.

It does, why do people not check the links. I used to be so paranoid, I check Baloo's and Jjjon's links.

[jjjon123]

A good point that I hadn't even thought to consider.  That's pretty inherent in the voters and certainly not something that can be addressed.

 

Yeah, in all these "tests" , the notes were one-liners with no/little links.

[~shenanigans]

I dont believe having lots of rep affects anything other than the quantity of upvotes on a good suggestion.

 

What has more say is how you present the proof, for example, the following suggestion has nice outlined proof but it only takes 5 seconds of clicking on the link to find out it is wrong. But it has a 75% upvote and a mod even upvoted it.

 

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513bb9044bd7b8e217000006

 

The notes have more impact than who you are, from what Ive seen.

*raises hand*

Yea I upvoted that suggestion. I was struck by the shiny lights and old price. I usually don't put as much effort into voting as I do when actually reviewing suggestions, although this is no excuse. I'll be even more careful from now on.

#shamefur_dispray #seppuku

[MC22]

*raises hand*

Yea I upvoted that suggestion. I was struck by the shiny lights and old price. I usually don't put as much effort into voting as I do when actually reviewing suggestions, although this is no excuse. I'll be even more careful from now on.

#shamefur_dispray #seppuku

Price is not tree fiddy D:

[The Killjoy]

Blue belts gets you more upvotes

If more upvotes = a higher chance of it being accepted, then yes, it influences. If not, then no.

[Baloo]

This is idiotic. Anyone can take the time to counter-proof any suggestion made by anyone. If they cannot do it, then there is no reason for a suggestion not to be accepted. Instead most people just complain about blue belts saying they have it easier.