EvilDEATH1234 Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Are you a fan? Personally, as a Libertarian, I feel it to be unnecessary and counter-productive. The idea of minimum wage is to give more workers a higher amount of money. This never happens in actuality. Consider that minimum wage was raised today. Firms would be required to pay their employees a higher price and still be making the same amount of profit, so they will be operating at a loss of money and will not be able to produce as efficiently. They will be forced to lay-off workers, causing fewer people to make more money, keeping the amount of money paid by the firms the same, but a smaller amount of people will receive a higher amount of money. This is creating a "wealthy elite" (term used very loosely) among the workers, and will cause firms to be less efficient in the long-run because they don't have enough workers to produce the same amount of goods/services as they did with more workers. In a social view, I feel it to be stupid too. Less people can obtain these jobs, and since the jobs are designed for people not making a living off of them, making these jobs harder to obtain causes less money to circulate in the 15-25 year old age group and more money to circulate between older people that should not be stealing the jobs of the less experienced. My thoughts, I could be wrong, but that is how I see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jelly jiggler Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Raise min wage by a dollar firms lose all profit seems legit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilDEATH1234 Posted March 26, 2015 Author Share Posted March 26, 2015 Raise min wage by a dollar firms lose all profit seems legit Not all, but still it causes inefficiency. It's undeniable that firms need to lay-off workers in order to maintain total profit, as it is a mathematical relationship, and since fewer workers can have a low skill job, its denying work to a larger population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jelly jiggler Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Not all, but still it causes inefficiency. It's undeniable that firms need to lay-off workers in order to maintain total profit, as it is a mathematical relationship, and since fewer workers can have a low skill job, its denying work to a larger population. Worked fine for canada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqkAudio Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 I don't understand what you're trying to say. Do you wish minimum wage laws didn't exist? That's what I got from what you wrote. If minimum wage didn't exists, there'd be jobs paying $3 an hour and less. Is that what you want? That aside, I was considering making a thread similar to this. Might as well throw it here since it kinda relates. Not sure if it's happening in other states but has anyone else heard about the current fast food strike that's going on here in California? Fast food workers are demanding their wage to be raised to $15 an hour. What do you think about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professional Map Painter Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Countries without minimum wage laws tend to be poorly developed or authoritarian dictatorships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Bakula Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 The core problem is at the top. Executives would rather pay themselves than give employees a livable wage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Scout Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 What you're trying to make out is that you don't think minimum wage is something that should required. That's what i'm getting from your opinion, But think of it in another way, if there was no minimum wage laws you would most likely be working for the same amount of money a worker in china gets payed. Is that how much you or your parents want to be payed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSkelly Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 They should make a maximum wage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tats Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 I voted for a minimum wage, I think it is a necessary measure if not already in place. They should make a maximum wage. Yes, I think it is a good idea but technically difficult to apply :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Bakula Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 No, a maximum wage is a bad idea. The core problem there is that once a person hits the pay wall, there's no incentive to go any further. Instead, the person would become Wally from Dilbert, doing only the absolute minimum amount of work to avoid getting fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AwesomeMcCoolName Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Not sure if it's happening in other states but has anyone else heard about the current fast food strike that's going on here in California? Fast food workers are demanding their wage to be raised to $15 an hour. What do you think about this? Fast food is already barely cheaper than normal (good) food...god help any of these fast food companies if they have to increase wages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
λngelღмander Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Raising minimum wage helps no one, because minimum wage dominates the types of basic services that the raise of minimum wage "attempts" to make more affordable. Raising minimum wage means an increase in tax revenue for the government, which one can't deny is a plus for them. And it doesn't help the consumer at all. The only helpful thing that the government could do would be to lower taxes on poor people, and not try to get that money back somewhere else. The government would have to do without some of its revenue, but poor people would have more money to allocate to necessary expenditures. Is the government really trying to help anything but itself when it raises minimum wage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkle Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Not sure what you're trying to say here. If we have minimum wage, it means that businesses legally cannot pay any less than that amount. Im not sure about other countries but the U.S. is actually raising minimum wage like crazy. Walmart just recently changed their minimum wage to $10 an hour I believe, Target changed theirs to $9 per hour (after losing $5.4 Billion or so from closing all Canadian stores. And losing about $2 Billion over the span of 7 Quarters), and McDonalds workers are currently going head to head with McDonalds for higher minimum wage. Once there popular business start paying more, you'll probably see more follow. If we didn't have minimum wage it would be pretty shitty. Businesses paying $3 an hour or something are not likely to have many good employees and will probably close down within a year or so. Of course, raising the wage of your workers does effect the company as well. It all accumulates and adds up to a significantly larger amount each year. If you're paying the workers monthly (for example) and you may not of made the money to pay all the other expenses for that month, you can probably see a lot more businesses taking out loans to pay their workers. Less people can obtain these jobs, and since the jobs are designed for people not making a living off of them, making these jobs harder to obtain causes less money to circulate in the 15-25 year old age group and more money to circulate between older people that should not be stealing the jobs of the less experienced. This really confused me. I don't know how money can circulate within an age group if you're spending it in the same country. If you mean that age groups will be spending less, perhaps this is true. Older people still are occupying the jobs that could be done by the younger generation though. Baby Boomers aren't retiring at the rate people expected because they don't have a whole lot of money saved for retirement, therefore won't be able to survive off of whatever social security provides for them. If you were talking about circulation of money though, this is totally up to inflation and deflation for the most part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistolvania Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Minimum wage isn't a thing in any of the Scandinavian countries, but we have collective agreements made by the labor unions, which I think is way better simply because those agreements are made and carried out by the workers and not the Government or the capitalists. The current minimum wage in USA seems incredibly low too. 7.25$ per hour sounds near impossible to live close to decent on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tats Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Minimum wage should obviously be indexed on inflation. But on which inflation rate ? There are different methods/basis to calculate this rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkle Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Minimum wage isn't a thing in any of the Scandinavian countries, but we have collective agreements made by the labor unions, which I think is way better simply because those agreements are made and carried out by the workers and not the Government or the capitalists. The current minimum wage in USA seems incredibly low too. 7.25$ per hour sounds near impossible to live close to decent on. It kinda already does, just not step for step. If that were to happen a hyper inflation would put minimum wage at over $100 probably and a deflation could bring it down to under $2. Depending on what index you base it off of it can all change too. Not sure on this, but here http://inequality.org/minimum-wage/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Bakula Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 The current minimum wage in USA seems incredibly low too. 7.25$ per hour sounds near impossible to live close to decent on. However, the cost of living varies dramatically depending on where a person is. In states with smaller minimum wages, like those in the midwest, the cost of living is much lower, so a person can more comfortably live on a smaller amount. For example, while an apartment in New York City will cost a person on average $3,000 a month, the same size apartment in South Dakota would only be about $500 per month, or less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqkAudio Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 The current minimum wage in USA seems incredibly low too. 7.25$ per hour sounds near impossible to live close to decent on. Following up to Scott's response. That's the federal minimum wage. States that have a higher cost of living have a higher minimum to help with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v³ Unknown NO FEAR Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Hey everyone, how about we raise the minimum wage to $20??? We'll help the poor by doing that, aren't we??????????? How about let's make it $100 an hour so everyone can be rich? No more poverty, checkmate stupid libertarians. /s Screw freedom, let's make every business suffer and force the owners to pay its employees more money than they deserve. Hell, why do I even bother studying at college if I can make $16-$20 an hour (the range where the liberals want the minimum to be) flipping burgers? The government should not be the one who decides on how much people should get paid. The people should, through negotiations and labour unions. Take Finland, Sweden, Norway, Switzerland, and many other European countries for example. Their citizens take an active role in forming unions and negotiating an agreed wage with employers. Liberals like to claim that without a minimum wage, we'd all be working in slavery conditions and earn meager wages. Doesn't look anything like that for those Scandinavian countries that don't have any minimum wage whatsoever. In fact, many may argue that the standards of living in those countries are much better than in America, and many studies confirm that the citizens from those countries are doing much better than Americans economically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
There Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Hell, why do I even bother studying at college if I can make $16-$20 an hour (the range where the liberals want the minimum to be) flipping burgers? Because you will always get paid more doing a job that requires more impressive credentials and labor is in very limited supply. For example, if I run a business that... say... engineers cars, but potential engineers are instead deciding to not go into engineering and instead work at minimum wage fast food restaurants, it's not like I'm going to say "lol i guess i have 2 close my buisness". I'm going to say that I still need to hire engineers, but I need to pay hire wages to lure more people into the field. It works out better for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSkelly Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 No, a maximum wage is a bad idea. The core problem there is that once a person hits the pay wall, there's no incentive to go any further. Instead, the person would become Wally from Dilbert, doing only the absolute minimum amount of work to avoid getting fired. Just make it really hard to get there, but worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splat Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Hey everyone, how about we raise the minimum wage to $20??? We'll help the poor by doing that, aren't we??????????? How about let's make it $100 an hour so everyone can be rich? No more poverty, checkmate stupid libertarians. /s Screw freedom, let's make every business suffer and force the owners to pay its employees more money than they deserve. Hell, why do I even bother studying at college if I can make $16-$20 an hour (the range where the liberals want the minimum to be) flipping burgers? The government should not be the one who decides on how much people should get paid. The people should, through negotiations and labour unions. Take Finland, Sweden, Norway, Switzerland, and many other European countries for example. Their citizens take an active role in forming unions and negotiating an agreed wage with employers. Liberals like to claim that without a minimum wage, we'd all be working in slavery conditions and earn meager wages. Doesn't look anything like that for those Scandinavian countries that don't have any minimum wage whatsoever. In fact, many may argue that the standards of living in those countries are much better than in America, and many studies confirm that the citizens from those countries are doing much better than Americans economically. If you're a libertarian why would you use any European country to back up any of your arguments? Lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobalt Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Just raise the minimum wage, liberal democrats for the win. To all you white Republicans out there, stop living in the past. This the present. The middle class is continually growing, and we must keep it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professional Map Painter Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 liberal democrats for the win. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Democrats Obama > Clegg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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