Heated Bread Posted February 11, 2014 Author Share Posted February 11, 2014 Sharking involves manipulation of the victim to gain profit off of them. This scenario does not involve manipulation of any sort. Imagine this: I know how to win a game because I know the secret, "X" of how to beat it. You don't know the secret, "X" of the same game. I challenge you to try to beat me at said game. You agree to the challenge (This is important) We settle on a wager of "Y." Whoever wins, gets the pot. Since I know the secret, "X," I can easily win, while you have a hard time figuring out how to win, therefore losing your wager. Basically, you're saying an Advanced player winning a bet against a Beginner player is scamming. I don't agree with your definition. You don't have to directly lie in order to shark someone. Anyway... Both players knowing how to properly play tic tac toe means that every game should end in a draw. When the game does not end in a draw, it means that the loser is either not aware of this, or they deliberately lost (confidence trick for the benefit of encouraging spectators to place a wager). The shark is someone who does know how to play and therefore will only lose if he intends to. Since he knows he cannot lose unless he wants to, even against an experienced opponent who has reached the game's low skill ceiling, there is no risk for him to continue betting. He can always either force a draw or win. When he wins, he collects the wager. When he does not win, he loses nothing since he was able to force a draw. The victim does not understand this. He believes he has a chance to win. Placing a wager is pointless when both players know how to properly play, since the game will always end in a draw. Therefore, requiring a loser to pay a wager is evidence that the shark is deliberately looking for someone who is not aware that either player can always force a draw. As soon as he collects any winnings at all, he is guilty. The problem is in distinguishing a casual game from a game with one or more sharks. If two players continue to play and always draw, they're obviously both sharks and eventually they'll have to stop playing eachother and look for other potential victims. They'll realize this and both will have identified eachother without ever having to exchange any words about it openly, and they can both move on. However, if a game has two sharks and one of them is playing a confidence trick by losing in order to lure potential victims into betting, it gets hard to outright prove that there is a shark at all (maybe later when he gets his items back from the other player, you'd be able to use that as evidence). Likewise, someone winning a few times does not necessarily mean that they are a shark. It may just mean that they are lucky and don't fully understand the game. This shit is really messed up. Back when I was in elementary school learning how to play tic tac toe, if you ever told me that I'd one day be explaining how people could use it to hustle others out of virtual items in an online first person shooter, I would probably just stare at you blankly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zcrab Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 It's not a scam. A scam is saying that you will do something but you wont. This is all clear: Win the game and you get a key, lose I get a key. Obiously if you have more than half a brain, or have played the game as a kid, then you know you can't win if both has a brain. But if he only starts with X and never play as O, then he has a bigger chance of winning, especially if it is some dumb kid trying to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puddingkip Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 That's a restricted version of Outpost's definition. If someone opened an unusual TC right here and I offered a key that, which he agreed to (because he's new), then I'm not sharking with your definition. Yes indeed. That's 100% not sharking. Dick move =/= sharking and definitely not scamming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AwesomeMcCoolName Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Yes indeed. That's 100% not sharking. Dick move =/= sharking and definitely not scamming its still sharking :S Taking advtange of someones lack of knowledge is sharking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco Blaze Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Yes indeed. That's 100% not sharking. Dick move =/= sharking and definitely not scamming its still sharking :S Taking advtange of someones lack of knowledge is sharking. McCool is right. It is even said in outpost's rules: Sharking is defined as manipulating another user into trading/selling a valuable item for 10% or less of its accepted value (or 20% or less for users with less than 200 hours in that game) or any other deceptive trading practice that the staff consider to be against the spirit of this rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AwesomeMcCoolName Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 McCool is right. It is even said in outpost's rules: Sharking is defined as manipulating another user into trading/selling a valuable item for 10% or less of its accepted value (or 20% or less for users with less than 200 hours in that game) or any other deceptive trading practice that the staff consider to be against the spirit of this rule. Well, OP isn't the law; but they finally did manage to phrase that properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco Blaze Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Well, OP isn't the law; but they finally did manage to phrase that properly. Yeah, but it is still a pretty accurate guideline. Still rather wordy, but it definitely is clear once you understand what it means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slocumruls Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 it's a ruse to get idiots that should be frowned upon. Other than not frequenting their servers there's nothing really you need to be doing about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puddingkip Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 McCool is right. It is even said in outpost's rules: Sharking is defined as manipulating another user into trading/selling a valuable item for 10% or less of its accepted value (or 20% or less for users with less than 200 hours in that game) or any other deceptive trading practice that the staff consider to be against the spirit of this rule. Sharking is manipulating people in order to buy their itemscheaply. If you put a buyout of 5 keys on a beams k.e. and I pay that I'm not sharking. Even if I added you and said : "hey can I buy your beams k.e. for 5 keys I'm not sharking. Outpost misuses the term sharking and bans for it, I hate that. They should ban for sharking, not for what I described above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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