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You are not "born" homosexual. I do not care if scientists and other people tell me that you can be. You are born with either male or female parts and you are born to mate with the opposite sex.

You are born to have sex with whoever you damn well please.

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That is called choice which we are not discussing here

Is being bisexual a choice? It means you know you can fuck the opposite sex, and you do, while still fucking the same

If it was a choice, don't you'd think they'd go for one or the other? Or they just can't decide?

 

#It'sallnatural

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Is being bisexual a choice? It means you know you can fuck the opposite sex, and you do, while still fucking the same

If it was a choice, don't you'd think they'd go for one or the other? Or they just can't decide?

 

#It'sallnatural

This discussion is about homosexuality so everything discussed so far applies to the "homo" part of being bi.

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You are not "born" homosexual. I do not care if scientists and other people tell me that you can be. You are born with either male or female parts and you are born to mate with the opposite sex.

So do you think people learn or choose to be homophile? I agree people aren't born homosexual. That just doesn't work with the definition, but I'm pretty sure most gay people were born homophile.

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You're making the assumption that the sole purpose of sex is reproduction, which it really isn't. 

 

Sex helps you connect with another person allowing you to share a deeper bond. It allows you to be more productive, it makes you less depressed, etc... If the sole purpose of having sex was to reproduce, then surely there would be a more effective way of doing so (since its possible for woman to have sex without getting pregnant).

 

I'm just going to say this. The primary purpose of sex is reproduction. The secondary purpose of sex is love, bonding, and intimacy for the primary purpose of keeping the mother and father together to raise their children. This is what sex is all about.

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I'm just going to say this. The primary purpose of sex is reproduction. The secondary purpose of sex is love, bonding, and intimacy for the primary purpose of keeping the mother and father together to raise their children. This is what sex is all about.

If sex was all about reproduction than why do humans usually have sex when women are infertile as opposed to animals who specifically wait for them to be in heat. 

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If sex was all about reproduction than why do humans usually have sex when women are infertile as opposed to animals who specifically wait for them to be in heat. 

 

Animals do not have emotions or intellect, and they wait because their instinct is to have sex to reproduce.

 

Infertility does not mean incompatability, infertility is a reproductive health problem. Most women who find out they are infertile are already married and expecting to have a sex life. Many infertile couples adopt as well, so even if they can't concieve they can still fulfill their roles as parents and spouse.

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So do you think people learn or choose to be homophile? I agree people aren't born homosexual. That just doesn't work with the definition, but I'm pretty sure most gay people were born homophile.

 

That is digressing from the main question.

 

The question being asked is: "How natural is homosexuality"

 

The answer to that question is "Homosexuality is not natural at all"

 

"Homosexuality" i.e. purposeful sex/mating for the purpose of sex between two animals of the same sex is found no way whatsoever outside of humans. i.e. it is found no where in nature. It is unnatural.

Any supposed "findings" by scientists are either very extreme cases or isnt actually homosexuality (two males that take care of a cub - no sex; male attempts to engage in intercourse with another male with little success - animal is stupid)

 

The word "Natural" can also refer to the physical traits of humans outside of thought or reason. (He has naturally occurring blue eyes)

 

Homosexuality is not a physical trait that occurs "naturally" to humans. Sexual attraction in general (also sexual intercourse in general, the need to have sex) as a "naturally occurring trait" has some basis in hormones etc. but other than birth defects, (for example, you are born with the wrong pair of genitals which is a real condition) homosexuality isn't a "natural" trait. It is a choice, as in, you choose who you pursue with your sexual attractions or your physical need to have sex.

 

Homosexuality is not natural at all.

 

OK, so what about your question? Are people born with an attraction to the same sex?

 

By definition, this question deals with human thought, reasoning, and influence which prevents it from being discussed as "natural". So whether it is true or not. It cannot be labeled as "natural" because it deals with human thought, reasoning, and influence.

 

I am not going to answer this question in this thread because it is an entire different subject. If you want to talk about that, then open up a new thread ;). All you need to know is that homosexuality is not natural as far as the word "natural" goes.

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 -text-

Let's talk about homosexuality in animals for a second, like you addressed in your comment

At first, homosexuality was to assert dominance, competition or greetings. While this is still true, a few animals have developed to enjoy having the company of the same gender, which is them adapting, and, in turn, is natural. And it's found several places in nature.

Read a book.

Humans and animals alike are born to make love with a certain sex. They can't change that

 

Here's a quote from a biologist that actually knows what he's talking about:

"Scientists who study the topic are often accused of trying to forward an agenda, and their work can come under greater scrutiny than that of their colleagues who study other topics. Not every sexual act has a reproductive function [...] that's true of humans and non-humans."

 

"male attempts to engage in intercourse with another male with little success - animal is stupid"

220px-Couple_of_two_male_mallard_ducks_-

These two Mallards (mammals) seem to both be interested in the thought of Homosexuality, not just one of them. They're embracing each other even.

 

Lastly, I'd like to close with a few pictures

 

Nature isn't natural!

Well there's a brain teaser.

Yum. Tastes like gay rights.

 

I won't argue this anymore. Bye

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 That is digressing from the main question.

Yes, but it's not irrelevant. It helps me put the other things you've set in perspective and understand your opinion better.

 

 

The question being asked is: "How natural is homosexuality"

 

The answer to that question is "Homosexuality is not natural at all"

 

"Homosexuality" i.e. purposeful sex/mating for the purpose of sex between two animals of the same sex is found no way whatsoever outside of humans. i.e. it is found no where in nature. It is unnatural.

Any supposed "findings" by scientists are either very extreme cases or isnt actually homosexuality (two males that take care of a cub - no sex; male attempts to engage in intercourse with another male with little success - animal is stupid)

This is just not true. Homosexuality does occur in other species, and not just 'by accident', so that argument is easily defeated.

 

 

The word "Natural" can also refer to the physical traits of humans outside of thought or reason. (He has naturally occurring blue eyes)

 

Homosexuality is not a physical trait that occurs "naturally" to humans. Sexual attraction in general (also sexual intercourse in general, the need to have sex) as a "naturally occurring trait" has some basis in hormones etc. but other than birth defects, (for example, you are born with the wrong pair of genitals which is a real condition) homosexuality isn't a "natural" trait. It is a choice, as in, you choose who you pursue with your sexual attractions or your physical need to have sex.

 

Homosexuality is not natural at all.

So you also think heterosexuality is unnatural? People are naturally attracted to other people, but they choose to have sex with them. What gender the person they have or don't have sex with is irrelevant.

 

 

OK, so what about your question? Are people born with an attraction to the same sex?

 

By definition, this question deals with human thought, reasoning, and influence which prevents it from being discussed as "natural". So whether it is true or not. It cannot be labeled as "natural" because it deals with human thought, reasoning, and influence.

I don't see how that prevents something from being discussed as natural.

 

 

 

I am not going to answer this question in this thread because it is an entire different subject. If you want to talk about that, then open up a new thread  ;). All you need to know is that homosexuality is not natural as far as the word "natural" goes.

This is a discussion thread, and clearly not everybody shares your opinion/uses the same definitions. I don't think "All you need to know" is appropriate here.

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Let's talk about homosexuality in animals for a second, like you addressed in your comment

At first, homosexuality was to assert dominance, competition or greetings. While this is still true, a few animals have developed to enjoy having the company of the same gender, which is them adapting to their surroundings, and, in turn, is natural. And it's found several places in nature.

 

Well, human beings have "adapted" to their surroundings to engineer cars and build computers. I don't think these are natural. The "adaption" argument doesn't seem to hold any ground.

 

Read a book.

Humans and animals alike are born to make love with a certain sex. They can't change that

 

See, this is true. So when they don't use these, um, parts in the way they were intended to be used, they are essentially avoiding their role in nature.

 

Here's a quote from a biologist that actually knows what he's talking about:

"Scientists who study the topic are often accused of trying to forward an agenda, and their work can come under greater scrutiny than that of their colleagues who study other topics. Not every sexual act has a reproductive function [...] that's true of humans and non-humans."

 

Yes, but the general purpose of sexual acts is to reproduce. While some actions that may be considered sexual between a male and a female animal may not necessarily have reproductive functions, it is to built a relationship between two animals that will eventually reproduce. This is not true with homosexuality.

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Well, human beings have "adapted" to their surroundings to engineer cars and build computers. I don't think these are natural. The "adaption" argument doesn't seem to hold any ground.

 

Heh. That's the worst argument I've seen yet. Surrundings have little to nothing to do with people engineering tech

 

 

See, this is true. So when they don't use these, um, parts in the way they were intended to be used, they are essentially avoiding their role in nature.

 

They aren't avoiding anything if they were born to have be attracted to the same sex

 

Yes, but the general purpose of sexual acts is to reproduce. While some actions that may be considered sexual between a male and a female animal may not necessarily have reproductive functions, it is to built a relationship between two animals that will eventually reproduce. This is not true with homosexuality.

 

True, homosexuality doesn't produce offspring, but it builds a bond. You don't have to have offspring to make that bond

Most do it for enjoyment, relax, etc. If you took a poll, how many people would say they only have sex to have another child?

Probably one out of at least a hundred people want to have a baby while having sex every time, so reproduction isn't of the utmost importance to most people on the World. They just wanna have fun and get down and dirty.

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Well, human beings have "adapted" to their surroundings to engineer cars and build computers. I don't think these are natural. The "adaption" argument doesn't seem to hold any ground.

 

Heh. That's the worst argument I've seen yet. Surrundings have little to nothing to do with people engineering tech

 

Yes, exactly, your argument is just as dumb. Animals haven't "adapted into their surroundings" to become homosexual.

 

See, this is true. So when they don't use these, um, parts in the way they were intended to be used, they are essentially avoiding their role in nature.

 

They aren't avoiding anything if they were born to have be attracted to the same sex

 

If they were born to be attracted to the same sex, then why do they have the parts of something that is attracted to the opposite?

 

Yes, but the general purpose of sexual acts is to reproduce. While some actions that may be considered sexual between a male and a female animal may not necessarily have reproductive functions, it is to built a relationship between two animals that will eventually reproduce. This is not true with homosexuality.

 

True, homosexuality doesn't produce offspring, but it builds a bond. You don't have to have offspring to make that bond

Most do it for enjoyment, relax, etc. If you took a poll, how many people would say they only have sex to have another child?

Probably one out of at least a hundred people want to have a baby while having sex every time, so reproduction isn't of the utmost importance to most people on the World. They just wanna have fun and get down and dirty.

 

In nature, the bond doesn't matter. Enjoyment, relaxation, etc, doesn't matter in any way in nature. It only matters in humans, and that is not what we have been talking about in this thread.

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I didn't say they adapted to their surroundings to become homosexual. I said they've done it before, so they adapted to do it again

 

Maybe in the future, homosexuals will begin to remove their genitalia completely so this don't have genders

 

I have a dog. My dog loves me. She knows my name, I feed her, she cuddles. If that's not a bond, I don't know what is.

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I didn't say they adapted to their surroundings to become homosexual. I said they've done it before, so they adapted to do it again

 

Maybe in the future, homosexuals will begin to remove their genitalia completely so this don't have genders

 

I have a dog. My dog loves me. She knows my name, I feed her, she cuddles. If that's not a bond, I don't know what is.

 

While this is still true, a few animals have developed to enjoy having the company of the same gender, which is them adapting to their surroundings, and, in turn, is natural. And it's found several places in nature.

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Many animals, particularly higher primates are predominantly onmisexual; probably because it's fun. I've seen bonobos nearly pull the cock off themselves in the zoo. It is "natural" though, just like worms that can live in arsenic rich soil, or fauna that live on thermal vents in the sea. What's unnatural to a limited human perception is often just normal in the regular world.

 

I was never one who bought into the "born gay" idea either. Granted we are all individuals but there are huge portions of human developmental and evolutionary psychobiology that we just don't f'ing understand yet. No child is born with any sexual identity necessarily. I'd go as far as to say you only know your sexual identify from puberty onwards.

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jjjon is just playing the devil's advocate.

 

Maybe he is, maybe he's not. I don't really care. I personally don't think homosexuality is "natural", but that doesn't mean I can discriminate marriage rights, etc, against homosexuals. 

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I'm going to quote my first post since it seems nobody read it.

The human body is not physically designed (whether divine or by nature) for sex between two people of the same gender. Anal sex is normally painful, dirty, and dry without hours/days of preparation. It requires artificial lube and condoms for safety, and even then can be very harmful. Scissoring just... defies logic. Homosexuals are also at a much higher risk for STD's, HIV and AIDS and are diagnosed at a higher rate.

That's pretty ignorant, one of the main reasons why people don't support gay marriage is because it means denying that all children deserve a mother and father. Raising a kid under poor circumstances is one thing, but to intentionally separate them from a biological parent and leave them without a male or female role-model, I don't agree with that.

 

I guess this is a little off-topic, though, so I won't say anymore regarding this.

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