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Admins, we demand an honest answer


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WHY votes with NEGATIVE ratio have been acepted and some votes with POSITIVE ratio doesn't pass.

 

Major Example: Keys

 

The main reson why its called VOTE is because the community decides. If the community voted down, it shouldn't be approved, and WHY admind still approves this votes?

 

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50cbc90aba2536e27c000017  --->3-3.1 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5148cdbeba2536916500000b ---> 4-4.2 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50ad73ebba25363232000060 ---> 2.7-2.8 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/51453abdba2536456c000002 ---> 4ref ( POSITIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513f98eeba25366418000006 ---> 4-4.1 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50ca4c3bba2536a56e00001f ---> 3ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513a4006ba2536b86c000012 ---> 3.8-4.1 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5131fb4cba2536ee35000004 ---> 3.7-4 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50ecad1eba2536bc2f000001 ---> 3.2-3.4 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5121b042ba2536ae3a000001 ---> 3.6-3.7 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50a9bdb8ba2536720a000036 ---> 2.6-2.7 ref ( POSITIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/510981f6ba25368d6c000003 ---> 3.3-3.5 ref ( POSITIVE RATIO)

 

 

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The reason all those suggestions with more negative than postive votes get accepted is because they are accurate suggestion and people only downvote them because they do not want to see keys go up in price.

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If you would ever take a second to pay attention, this has been answered time and time again.  Staff do their own research as well, and if they are going against majority, they usually post a reason why.  

 

First link, Sir J-j-jon said "This is why I'm accepting" and had a link to another suggestion.

Second: http://prntscr.com/x8t5w

 

I'm not going to find every single one of them for you, because you should be able to take a few minutes and find them all yourself.  Let me know if you have any real questions when you read through all of those.

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Read the comments.

 

Reasons for downvoting:

Because the suggester has too many keys

Because the economy

Because key prices are getting too high

Because this will cause key prices to go higher

Because outpost has highballers

Because there's no reason for keys to be so high

Because traders are greedy

Because I will go to the spreadsheet if this passes

Because I do not want key prices to be so high

 

Not a single word of:

Because this isn't what keys are trading at

 

So many comments, a full two days to show it's erronous, and not a single person among the thousand downvoters can demonstrate the suggested key price is inaccurate.

 

People are voting on what they want, not on the accuracy of the price. So long as that's how people are voting, the vote can't be trusted. This is a community run price guide in that anyone can suggest, anyone can contribute. But ultimately it's about accuracy. If the vote could always be trusted for accuracy, there'd be no need for mods. Suggestions would run for a set period and get accepted based on vote. As the key suggestions serve to prove, that is not the case.

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@Distinctively Vincent.Text interpretation isnt that hard. Im making a question about the RATIO/ACCEPTANCE ( idk if this word exist, english isn't my main language, but i hope you get the idea) of suggestions, not key prices

WHY votes with NEGATIVE ratio have been acepted and some votes with POSITIVE ratio doesn't pass.

 

Major Example: Keys

 

The main reson why its called VOTE is because the community decides. If the community voted down, it shouldn't be approved, and WHY admind still approves this votes?

 

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50cbc90aba2536e27c000017  --->3-3.1 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5148cdbeba2536916500000b ---> 4-4.2 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50ad73ebba25363232000060 ---> 2.7-2.8 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/51453abdba2536456c000002 ---> 4ref ( POSITIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513f98eeba25366418000006 ---> 4-4.1 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO )

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50ca4c3bba2536a56e00001f ---> 3ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513a4006ba2536b86c000012 ---> 3.8-4.1 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5131fb4cba2536ee35000004 ---> 3.7-4 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50ecad1eba2536bc2f000001 ---> 3.2-3.4 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5121b042ba2536ae3a000001 ---> 3.6-3.7 ref ( NEGATIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/50a9bdb8ba2536720a000036 ---> 2.6-2.7 ref ( POSITIVE RATIO)

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/510981f6ba25368d6c000003 ---> 3.3-3.5 ref ( POSITIVE RATIO)

1st link - OK

2nd link: OK

3rd- OK

4th - Kinda OK

5th- Cant find anything

6th- Cant see anything

7th-  Again, nothing

8th-  "scrap.tf is sold out at 4 refined. Several 4 ref sellers sold out on Outpost. Finance reporting a 3.88 average for the last few days. Despite the votes here, I think this price is more accurate than the current 3.77 - 3.88." (gold in my dick, what up) --> Despite the whole community going against, one admin simply accept it, without any real proof, just his "i think".  opnion>proof, way to go backpack

9th- i think im turning blind, i cant see anything

10- "fine"

11-fine

12- Nothing here

 

If you would ever take a second to pay attention, this has been answered time and time again.  Staff do their own research as well, and if they are going against majority, they usually post a reason why.  

 

First link, Sir J-j-jon said "This is why I'm accepting" and had a link to another suggestion.

Second: http://prntscr.com/x8t5w

 

I'm not going to find every single one of them for you, because you should be able to take a few minutes and find them all yourself.  Let me know if you have any real questions when you read through all of those.

 

Well, i did that, and you know what? I still havent got an answer. WHY vote with negative ratio passes? Because one admins THINK that its correct without showing some COUNTER-PROOF? besides everyone going againt it, showing proofs suporting it? If admins can do that, why the hell votes still exist? They simply accept or close it, without any logic

 

 

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Admins, we demand an honest answer

 

please don't speak on our behalf.  Every single one of those suggestions was accurate and deserving of approval.

 

 WHY vote with negative ratio passes? Because one admins THINK that its correct without showing some COUNTER-PROOF? besides everyone going againt it, showing proofs suporting it? If admins can do that, why the hell votes still exist? They simply accept or close it, without any logic

 

The better question is "Why are accurate suggestions, backed by proof, receiving negative ratios."  And it's because people become irrational when voting on keys.  The admins and most everyone else know this.  As for the admins having to consider counter-proof: what is it countering?  The original post is full of proof links.  It is the downvoters that provide no counter-proof.  I am of the opinion that the vote shouldn't exist, but it does because the admins feel that the community should be allowed to voice its opinion and provide couter-proof.  If they continue to waste that opportunity, their input won't matter.

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@Distinctively Vincent.Text interpretation isnt that hard. Im making a question about the RATIO/ACCEPTANCE ( idk if this word exist, english isn't my main language, but i hope you get the idea) of suggestions, not key prices

Well, i did that, and you know what? I still havent got an answer. WHY vote with negative ratio passes? Because one admins THINK that its correct without showing some COUNTER-PROOF? besides everyone going againt it, showing proofs suporting it? If admins can do that, why the hell votes still exist? They simply accept or close it, without any logic

 

 

Care to give some non-key examples then? Beyond being the most transparent item on the market, each and every example given either had sufficient proof/counter-proof in the comments and/or a followup from the admin.

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please don't speak on our behalf.  Every single one of those suggestions were accurate and deserving of approval.

 

 

The better question is "Why are accurate suggestions, backed by proof, receiving negative ratios."  And it's because people become irrational when voting on keys.  The admins and most everyone else know this.  As for the admins having to consider counter-proof: what is it countering?  The original post is full of proof links.  It is the downvoters that provide no counter-proof.  I am of the opinion that the vote shouldn't exist, but it does because the admins feel that the community should be allowed to voice its opinion and provide couter-proof.  If they continue to waste that opportunity, their input won't matter.

 

 

This, please. I was about to ask who "we" was. If you want answers, ask on your own behalf. I personally am satisfied with the answers that have been given in the past by cleverpun and gold in my dick, what up.

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Alright. let's gather up 1000 owners of buds, make a bud suggestion for 50 keys. Let's say the actual votes are 1000-300

 

Should the new price be accepted?

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Alright. let's gather up 1000 owners of buds, make a bud suggestion for 50 keys. Let's say the actual votes are 1000-300

 

Should the new price be accepted?

 

 

NEIN!

 

Also, see: Genuine Archimedes.

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Care to give some non-key examples then? Beyond being the most transparent item on the market, each and every example given either had sufficient proof/counter-proof in the comments and/or a followup from the admin.

 

No, i dont want. This happens 99,999% on keys. Finding examples on other items are way hard

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I'm gonna make a key suggestion to lower the price.

 

It would then pass without ANY proof because so many people want it to lower.

 

It would make the site look bad.

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No, i dont want. This happens 99,999% on keys. Finding examples on other items are way hard

It is only on keys

All the poor people care about keys

The 4 ref guy

He had a complete understanding of manipulation

I see you fell into his trap.

And by "We" you mean everyone who does not vote except for key suggestions.

 

Reason you can't find other examples is frankly

THERE ARE NONE!

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The voting system encourages feedback from users. However, there is no restriction on voting, and anyone is free to vote however they wish. This means that voting is skewed by personal preferences and desires, instead of factual evidence.

 

Here's an example. Imagine you have 200 keys in your inventory. You paid 4 ref each for them, because you really wanted keys. Now, a price suggestion comes along and claims keys should be 3 ref. Even without looking at evidence, what would you decide? It is only logical that you want to make a return on your investment, so you would disagree. Now, imagine that you have no keys but 3 refined. The same suggestion comes along; again, without looking at evidence, you would want to upvote because you desire to be able to purchase a key at 3 ref instead of 4. We cannot hold you responsible for how you vote, except by a + or - one reputation point on your profile.

 

It is also possible to skew the evidence by cherry picking. For example, if I gather 20 trades selling keys for 2.66 ref, and only present that as evidence, does it mean the suggestion is good? Voters may think "Oh there's a bunch of proof, so it might be correct" and upvote the suggestion. But that would not be an accurate representation of the market. This is why admins look over price suggestions and make a decision. 99% of the time votes match what the admins find, and there is no problem. The 1% of the time a suggestion is chosen contrary to public opinion, and everyone jumps on it, saying "LOOK AT THIS BP.TF IS CORRUPT!"

 

Sure, key suggestions can be controversial. But we aim to reflect the market price. Even if you shoot the messenger, it doesn't change the fact.

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The BEST example I can use for this entire situation:

 

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/514a2ad04bd7b8700b000001

% Positive   89.78%

 

Closed.   Why?  Everyone upvoted the blue belt without actually looking and seeing that he was wrong.

 

Point being, most of these people aren't actually looking around before they blindly make their vote.  In the case of keys, they upvote it because they wish it was that price, or downvote it because they wish it wasn't.  In the case of most other items with this situation, people don't actually look around before voting.

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We already have a system in place for requesting admin explanations for their decisions

 

http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/75-guidelines-for-suggestion-question-threads/

 

The votes are only one part of a system of checks and balances. They do have influence, but do not have absolute power, which is how things should be in a proper system of checks and balances.

 

The mods, votes, and proof are all there to help ensure that reasonably accurate suggestions get passed. If a suspicious or poor price passes, then the community is there to question why.

 

You have received several answers to your question from plenty of people--if you can give me a good enough reason to unlock this thread, PM me.

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