rare vintages dupes and price suggestions

[Vegan T-Rex]

idk, vegan said it first then I followed him

?

what 

[Pyroman]

Wait wut, I was pretty sure vegan mentioned them before in this thread

I must be still asleep

[Vegan T-Rex]

I never said anything about PEASANT cashing out...?

[♠Derpeh♤]

This has been the most interesting thread ive read in ages.

 

Also regarding pyroman's manipulation of prices...etc he/she is "manipulating" with good proof. I see no issues.

[Pyroman]

I never said anything about PEASANT cashing out...?

idk, I must've been stoned then (geddit? I did lots of pot yesterday on the site, no?)

if anything, then it was someone who mentioned PEASANT as an example of cashed out people and posted before me

[Vegan T-Rex]

This has been the most interesting thread ive read in ages.

 

Also regarding pyroman's manipulation of prices...etc he/she is "manipulating" with good proof. I see no issues.

^THIS

ALL OF THIS

[Woifi The Viking]

>she

>she

>SHE

 

 

Well after the picture incident, I don't call them a she any longer.

[Wesley]

*insert quotes here*

quote 1 is about pyroman's gender

 

second one about PEASANT.

[Woifi The Viking]

quote 1 is about pyroman's gender

 

second one about PEASANT.

woops, so it's actually pyrowoman? You'll never know with dem pyros...

[puddingkip]

Wait wut, I was pretty sure vegan mentioned them before in this thread

I must be still asleep

It was me. I knew it was hijacked (too much he she cirklejerking). Thought it cashed out after getting them back. Why do I always confuse people?

[polar]

Alright. Some moderating here. Please keep posts to those relevant to the discussion.

 

To the regular bp.tf community members:

Step back for a sec and try to consider what â¤Î£ÎºÎ±Ï€Î±Î½Î­Î±Ï‚Gr⤠is saying from the perspective of an outsider. Think about what an outsider who doesn't frequent the forums thinks when he sees people with bp's worth 5-10 buds (or less) making suggestions on 30-100 buds hats. Or what an avid collector of rare items might think about how we price rare vintages, etc. I am a huge proponent of transparency, and things that are discussed within our community in the forums often don't spread beyond the forums. For example, I think Pyroman deserves an exception to our rule and his and Chigga's well-documented trade to enable him to make suggestions wasn't a problem for me. But this would NOT be obvious to outsiders. If I were an outsider, I might initially think his account was an alt if I didn't know him / look at his steam profile. Instead of bashing outsiders, please inform them. Transparency is important and it can be hard for people to see all that goes on in the forums.

 

To â¤Î£ÎºÎ±Ï€Î±Î½Î­Î±Ï‚Grâ¤:

(1) Instead of flat out libel in a public forum, please add a mod directly if you have issues with particular individuals. Your comments about PEASANT and Pyroman / Chigga just give you less credibility with your "research" methods, and your concerns are easily appeased by simply having a conversation with a mod. Flat out accusations here just make people hate you and don't help your cause at all.

 

(2) Prices on this website are based on how the community as a whole values an item. The lines get blurred here with rare items like unusuals and vintages, but we try to base our prices on common trade points and offers. And we consider absurdly high offers higher than commonly offered values outliers, even for unusuals. The same idea applies to rare vintages. Prices are not based on what an occasional collector values them at but what the community does as a whole. As such, there hasn't been a problem with recent rare vintage suggestions with prices being lowered based on b/o's. If you would like to go buy every duped copy of the vintage alien swarm to delete them, that would be awesome. But as is, I'm not seeing an issue with pricing off the commonly traded dupes.

[KingOfHeart]

BTW, why do you keep bringing up long like he's a manipulator..You know why he was banned in the first place, right? His attitude with his comments was the reason he was banned.

(Unless if I misunderstood what you meant)

 

If you're trying to make an argument that poor people should not make suggestions for expensive items..then I got a fair idea.

More Expensive Item  = More Rep Points needed and/or Be rich enough

 

Not everyone is rich but know their prices well. If they have are experienced enough to make good price suggestions, they should not be limited to only poor items.

[❤ΣκαπανέαςGr❤]

BTW, why do you keep bringing up long like he's a manipulator..You know why he was banned in the first place, right? His attitude with his comments was the reason he was banned.

(Unless if I misunderstood what you meant)

 

If you're trying to make an argument that poor people should not make suggestions for expensive items..then I got a fair idea.

More Expensive Item  = More Rep Points needed and/or Be rich enough

 

Not everyone is rich but know their prices well. If they have are experienced enough to make good price suggestions, they should not be limited to only poor items.

I like your idea about a rep/rare analogy for suggestors

or  a more rep more suggestions per month perk

[❤ΣκαπανέαςGr❤]

Alright. Some moderating here. Please keep posts to those relevant to the discussion.

 

To the regular bp.tf community members:

Step back for a sec and try to consider what â¤Î£ÎºÎ±Ï€Î±Î½Î­Î±Ï‚Gr⤠is saying from the perspective of an outsider. Think about what an outsider who doesn't frequent the forums thinks when he sees people with bp's worth 5-10 buds (or less) making suggestions on 30-100 buds hats. Or what an avid collector of rare items might think about how we price rare vintages, etc. I am a huge proponent of transparency, and things that are discussed within our community in the forums often don't spread beyond the forums. For example, I think Pyroman deserves an exception to our rule and his and Chigga's well-documented trade to enable him to make suggestions wasn't a problem for me. But this would NOT be obvious to outsiders. If I were an outsider, I might initially think his account was an alt if I didn't know him / look at his steam profile. Instead of bashing outsiders, please inform them. Transparency is important and it can be hard for people to see all that goes on in the forums.

 

To â¤Î£ÎºÎ±Ï€Î±Î½Î­Î±Ï‚Grâ¤:

(1) Instead of flat out libel in a public forum, please add a mod directly if you have issues with particular individuals. Your comments about PEASANT and Pyroman / Chigga just give you less credibility with your "research" methods, and your concerns are easily appeased by simply having a conversation with a mod. Flat out accusations here just make people hate you and don't help your cause at all.

 

(2) Prices on this website are based on how the community as a whole values an item. The lines get blurred here with rare items like unusuals and vintages, but we try to base our prices on common trade points and offers. And we consider absurdly high offers higher than commonly offered values outliers, even for unusuals. The same idea applies to rare vintages. Prices are not based on what an occasional collector values them at but what the community does as a whole. As such, there hasn't been a problem with recent rare vintage suggestions with prices being lowered based on b/o's. If you would like to go buy every duped copy of the vintage alien swarm to delete them, that would be awesome. But as is, I'm not seeing an issue with pricing off the commonly traded dupes.

yes all of those said by polar are in the back of my head

he did a better work saying what i was trying to all this time

 

as for the dupes i hope we vintage enthousiasts and collectors will work together to clean that mess the dupes have created to the vintges

they might be pixels but are pixels that have been our companions for many years now

and they deserve a place on the pantheon of tf2 world

 

it will be easier as they drop though as it is hard to delete 6 buds

just for the fun of it.

[Spu~]

Hating on spu is nice... :c. And you're saying I'm not being polite... I never directly called you a "lier." (check your spelling) and I don't see how I'm not being polite. You're the one going out of your way to make my suggestion not valid. You bought a vintage alien swarm HOURS after I posted the suggestion. I don't see that as being very nice. And you're calling me a kid, throwing away the tf2 community. You decide to spam the suggestion with repeated comments, each 2 paragraphs long. And I can make suggestions and vote on suggestions in the double digits of buds because of something called the rep system. I get more rep as I make successful suggestions and successful votes. My backpack value is multiplied based on how much rep I have. You're also blackmailing Pyroman by threatening to spam links on his suggestions... really? 

 

All in all, you've lost all of my respect. You blame me for not being polite, fine. I won't be as nice to you. You win. But, when my suggestion is accepted, you'll just have to cry about it.

[Roller]

 When suggestors are trying to price rare irems that some times are not going to be traded for several months 

they have to present to us screenshots of the

given trades

 When the items are that rare beeing dupe makes little to no difference

but constanty use dupes to suggest a price on an item that has some cleans left is also unacceptable

Those techniques are been used by a lot of ppl that are suggesting the way Long218 used to

and they have a lot of similarity.

also i see lately persons with 30$ bp

that have never bought or contribute in any way to the game to

suggest prices in items that are well out of their reach they have no personal experience with it

and they are valuing them according to offers

I thought there where restrictions to what can someone suggest to..

Has that rule changed?

if yes i am afraid more Long 218 with alt accounts will continue his work.

 

 

 Most collectors are very polite and cooperative and they will provide to you the proofs you need to complete your suggestions

just don't be kids and go like what'd up bitch

I want to suggest a new price on your hat hommie

 

Don't do that.

probably he is a man at my age 30-35years old that love tf2 and hate stupid kids

 

be polite be efficient

get screen shots

example

-hello sir

-hi

-you have recently trade you vintage shortstop

are you kind enough to provide a screenshot of the trade to update its price?

thanks

-ok a sec

 

try it it is easy and when you are polite ppl are going to help you.

 

stop pricing the rare hats and weapons that count below 10-20 units

without researching throughout

 

in this suggestion I am informing the suggestor what was the trade involved and he is calling me a lier without even bother to take a look if my statement is truth or not

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5250c6ec4cd7b8c9578b4568#52528dc64dd7b89c338b4568_row

when easily he can go and check his bp or his trades or mine. and update his suggestion as he is meant to do

 

those are not keys

those are not buds

those are tf2 legacy

 

don't expect from the owners to sell them with ease

don't expect some kids to know who Carter is

 

Brad pitt we need an extra rule on those items.

more excessive proofs not a couple of links and some offers but the actual trade

in a screenshot

 

if you have some ideas share it here with me..

thanks

 

I had took a look with Vintages before. Everyone of them. And I'm pretty sure that there are only 2 cleans in the Community. One, you bought it. And the other one was gave to another guy, which is gave for free. So, if there are only 2 cleans in the market, and one ain't selling, then there will only have 1. Which is stupid if you suggest it in price.

 

Plus, the last suggestion is based on dupes. If you try making it on clean, it will make some misunderstanding to people which is using it as price.

 

All your hates are just not good. We are just here to help the tf2 community, are we not?

[Pyroman]

I had took a look with Vintages before. Everyone of them. And I'm pretty sure that there are only 2 cleans in the Community. One, you bought it. And the other one was gave to another guy, which is gave for free. So, if there are only 2 cleans in the market, and one ain't selling, then there will only have 1. Which is stupid if you suggest it in price.

 

Plus, the last suggestion is based on dupes. If you try making it on clean, it will make some misunderstanding to people which is using it as price.

 

All your hates are just not good. We are just here to help the tf2 community, are we not?

Roller's got a good point here, all skapaneas is trying to do is to make the situation worse just to make his argument true (which in the end would just be false since he would delete the only clean alien swarm 'for fun'). We're trying to help the community out here.

The current price on the vintage promos are mostly based on dupes, so they hardly ever have prices set only on the clean ones (since there are some that don't even have a clean copy), so your argument is invalid anyway.

[Professional Map Painter]

Roller's got a good point here, all skapaneas is trying to do is to make the situation worse just to make his argument true (which in the end would just be false since he would delete the only clean alien swarm 'for fun').

Someone deleted the #4 Market Gardener for the very same reason, instead of keeping it or selling it to the collector who was interested.

 

you dont that is why those exploits must be eliminated before bp.tf follow spreadsheets fate.

http://forums.steamrep.com/threads/tf2-spreadsheet-scandal.9913/

 

I can't see any similarities.

[❤ΣκαπανέαςGr❤]

Alright. Some moderating here. Please keep posts to those relevant to the discussion.

 

To the regular bp.tf community members:

Step back for a sec and try to consider what â¤Î£ÎºÎ±Ï€Î±Î½Î­Î±Ï‚Gr⤠is saying from the perspective of an outsider. Think about what an outsider who doesn't frequent the forums thinks when he sees people with bp's worth 5-10 buds (or less) making suggestions on 30-100 buds hats. Or what an avid collector of rare items might think about how we price rare vintages, etc. I am a huge proponent of transparency, and things that are discussed within our community in the forums often don't spread beyond the forums. For example, I think Pyroman deserves an exception to our rule and his and Chigga's well-documented trade to enable him to make suggestions wasn't a problem for me. But this would NOT be obvious to outsiders. If I were an outsider, I might initially think his account was an alt if I didn't know him / look at his steam profile. Instead of bashing outsiders, please inform them. Transparency is important and it can be hard for people to see all that goes on in the forums.

 

To â¤Î£ÎºÎ±Ï€Î±Î½Î­Î±Ï‚Grâ¤:

(1) Instead of flat out libel in a public forum, please add a mod directly if you have issues with particular individuals. Your comments about PEASANT and Pyroman / Chigga just give you less credibility with your "research" methods, and your concerns are easily appeased by simply having a conversation with a mod. Flat out accusations here just make people hate you and don't help your cause at all.

 

(2) Prices on this website are based on how the community as a whole values an item. The lines get blurred here with rare items like unusuals and vintages, but we try to base our prices on common trade points and offers. And we consider absurdly high offers higher than commonly offered values outliers, even for unusuals. The same idea applies to rare vintages. Prices are not based on what an occasional collector values them at but what the community does as a whole. As such, there hasn't been a problem with recent rare vintage suggestions with prices being lowered based on b/o's. If you would like to go buy every duped copy of the vintage alien swarm to delete them, that would be awesome. But as is, I'm not seeing an issue with pricing off the commonly traded dupes.

"(2) Prices on this website are based on how the community as a whole values an item. The lines get blurred here with rare items like unusuals and vintages, but we try to base our prices on common trade points and offers. And we consider absurdly high offers higher than commonly offered values outliers, even for unusuals. The same idea applies to rare vintages. Prices are not based on what an occasional collector values them at but what the community does as a whole. As such, there hasn't been a problem with recent rare vintage suggestions with prices being lowered based on b/o's. If you would like to go buy every duped copy of the vintage alien swarm to delete them, that would be awesome. But as is, I'm not seeing an issue with pricing off the commonly traded dupes."

 

That is the reason i have made this thread from the beggining

 

because of the lines are blurred on those rare high in value items  i thing we need to apply 1 more rule when suggesting on those

 I'll try to be clear and help you follow my thoughts

 

suggesters mostly use comments as proofs,in most cases a trade with a high value item is almost never without minor adjustments by both partys

  I only bought it to proove that exact thing to the mods and admin of the bp.tf site.

how I proove it

 

I went and offer 1 hat for something that was considered by the seller to be a set of 3 items

exhibit a) the vintage alien swarm parasite + strange festive knife + hound dog purple fetti those items together are at 9-10 buds and i offer my unusual kill a watt anger to the set witch is a 7.5-8 range

 so far so good.

From here own i will try to explain how the suggesters suggest and how they are mislead.

 

 The owner of the parasite really liked the anger (who wouldn't) and add me right after to chat me about the offer in 10-15 minutes or so

we chat and chat he wanted me to add like 2.8 buds in pure because of the difference between the items of the set

 we used the avg price of the anger for that, i then informed him that i am not interested either in the knife or the heavy unusual cause already i own 2 of my favourites heavy hats and the knife as well.

he then asked propose me if I want to 1:1 or if he had to add some sweets i asked him 4-5 keys in sweets , and he told me to pick up what i want

 I then took a look at his bp

I felt sorry for him and felt guilts to take sweets from that guy and honestly there where absolutely nothing i wanted to grab for other than the parasite

so i accepted the 1 to 1 trade after all.

 I have build up to the anger with an investment in a vivid mullet not more than 3 months ago witch i have bought for 1.2 buds I trade that for a miami nights pom-pommed and that for the anger so i didn't mind to give it away as i can build up if needed to any unusual i like.

 

resulting the suggester thought that the trade was a 3:1 trade just because of the comments on outpost.

 he is obligated to research about and not runs into fast conclusions.thats the suggester responsibility towards to the tf2 community

If it wasn't me that it would have been used by the next ''repwhore'-a term we use a lot here-  to lower the swarm parasite by another 2.8 buds

and that have been used again in the past and not only to rare vintages but to more qualities

 

 I am begging for an extra rule that it wont destroy suggestions and it will promote transparency on items that are not mainstream and count like 1 - 50 in the world

suggesters must provide screenshots of the trades in stake.

Or they must provide at least 1 trade complete dont accept the b.o or the offers as proofs for a suggestion on those.

1 guy with multiple accounts can spam suggest on those offers below 50% of the item value just to buy them all

that someone could be me or anyone.

we should not allow that as a possibility.

 

-in most cases those ppl will lower their price to the low end to get some pure just to invest somewhere else and they are willing to suffer some loses to liquefy

they also aware that they will have to wait for a long time until someone will buy it-

You will be surprised how friendly collectors are,if you are polite they will do anything for the tf2 community

Don't forget that this site has been build with the trust of the tf2 community to what it is today

so don't be afraid to ask of them for screenshots.

 

I tried to explain why outpost comments and offers are most of the time not accurate proofs on those.

 

 

if there is mistakes on my spelling etc again my apologies.also my apologies if you translate me as a raged man

my English don't help me to be understandable in many cases.

so my apologise to the kids that are trying to help by suggesting following the sites rules

and i expect higher standards for non mainstream items in the future offers and comments don't work that great and they can be faked in many cases too.

[❤ΣκαπανέαςGr❤]

 

[Woifi The Viking]

-snip-

Real collectors doesn't use the site anyway, they  know their item values.

 

That's why mods should be there, they check every suggestion and they sould have found out, that it was a 1:1 trade and not a 1:3 one. Nobody is perfect btw.

Screenshots can be faked as well so enforcing this won't change nothing. Item histories is enough most of the time.

 

Also the suggestion is not based on offers, but on b/os that are lower than the high end or are just unsold for a long time. We are aware that someone could use the site for their own goods and those people should be reported to us and we will look into it and treat their suggestions with extra care.

[polar]

Real collectors doesn't use the site anyway, they  know their item values.

 

That's why mods should be there, they check every suggestion and they sould have found out, that it was a 1:1 trade and not a 1:3 one. Nobody is perfect btw.

Screenshots can be faked as well so enforcing this won't change nothing. Item histories is enough most of the time.

 

Also the suggestion is not based on offers, but on b/os that are lower than the high end or are just unsold for a long time. We are aware that someone could use the site for their own goods and those people should be reported to us and we will look into it and treat their suggestions with extra care.

 

Adding on to what Woifi says. Real collectors don't care how a pricelist evaluates their items.

 

And the beauty of this website is that if a mistake is made anyone can resuggest. We will not be raising the requirements of proof of this website to mandate screenshots of trade histories for every single rare item. We get 1000's of rare item - unusuals, rare vintages, self-made, etc - suggestions every month. If something was stated on outpost, that is usually what the trade is for. We will leave the suggestion up on bp.tf for comments and if it is missed even there, it can always be corrected with a new suggestion. I don't see any problems with the way the system is designed

[MC22]

I choose to to read a topic for a few days and miss a major shitstorm, I am sade doge

[❤ΣκαπανέαςGr❤]

Real collectors doesn't use the site anyway, they  know their item values.

 

That's why mods should be there, they check every suggestion and they sould have found out, that it was a 1:1 trade and not a 1:3 one. Nobody is perfect btw.

Screenshots can be faked as well so enforcing this won't change nothing. Item histories is enough most of the time.

 

Also the suggestion is not based on offers, but on b/os that are lower than the high end or are just unsold for a long time. We are aware that someone could use the site for their own goods and those people should be reported to us and we will look into it and treat their suggestions with extra care.

regardless http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5250c6ec4cd7b8c9578b4568

 

the 3rd link used as proof is fixed to support the suggester range

I'll paste his approach here:

" http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/14751264 sold for gifted roboactive pom pom (???) (outlier, user wanted to quit unusual tradin) (had a b/o of 6)"

 

he is missleading the voters about the b.o of the swarm (witch is a pure b.o) to make it look like is the b.o of the unusual (there for the drop of the high end is excused)/i know b.o's are not proofs and gifted dont count as proof as well.

 

in fact the offer was an unusual overpay that support the current range of the item.given that i have trade the miami nights pom-pommed-for the anger kill a watt and that for the swarm.i guess the roboactive is higher than the kill a watt even if gifted or in the same range as that at worstcase scenario.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/14716374

twisting the facts and/or hiding info according to suggest a range shouldn't be tolerated either in my opinion.

 

I can accept everything about you are saying that collectors dont need guidance and all but some suggesters seem to form their suggestions without proper respect to the traders involved hiding vital informations from the voters in best and missinformed them to achieve the acceptance of their suggestion.

 

I hope you are not offended by me sharing my concerns here.

 

I have added you to give you this informations but I guess you will see them in time here as well to provide them to the mod that is moderating that suggestion.

[Woifi The Viking]

regardless http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5250c6ec4cd7b8c9578b4568

 

the 3rd link used as proof is fixed to support the suggester range

I'll paste his approach here:

" http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/14751264 sold for gifted roboactive pom pom (???) (outlier, user wanted to quit unusual tradin) (had a b/o of 6)"

 

he is missleading the voters about the b.o of the swarm (witch is a pure b.o) to make it look like is the b.o of the unusual (there for the drop of the high end is excused)/i know b.o's are not proofs and gifted dont count as proof as well.

The sites prices are in pure. If he would accept 6 pure, but gets a 7 bud unsusual, we still count the sale at 6 pure.