Informality of Forums and Linguistic Complexity

[ℕ Hilbert-WARing Theorem™]

You said it yourself, it was written more verbosely than it needed to be. For what purpose? To make yourself sound smart? Lol. Why do you care? Use of language, regional dialect, subject-specific jargon, etc.... none of these things relate to your intelligence.

 

I'm actually the opposite to what you post, kinda as bob said. When I was a 15 year old online, I was super bothered about how I came across and used perfect grammar all the time, put a lot of thought into the way I phrased things, etc, etc. I don't give a shit now. I'm not writing an essay or a job application, I'm having a conversation with some people online. Either the conversation is casual in nature or if it's serious, I can get my point across much better by just typing in an easy to understand manner. What's the point of conversation to you? If it's to make your ideas understood by others, why over complicate your delivery? Who are you trying to impress? Half the people won't follow what you're on about, and the other half will think you're a pretentious twat, haha. Maybe one person in your audience will both follow and agree.

 

Well, you should have some background. I mostly write for an academic purpose and do not use the forums that frequently. On more academic forums, this type of language would be common-place, although of course there would be variation in language complexity. I am not trying to impress anybody in particular, this is simply the language style I have learned and adopted through my academic conditioning. I falsely assumed that many of these users would agree with my use of language. It was not to cause any kind of upset.

[Teeny Tiny Cat]

The problem with being pretentious over linguistics is that it's inherently classist and often racist, to be honest. It relates to education, not intelligence, but acts as if they're one and the same. People who speak english as a second language, or didn't finish high school, or are still in high school, are not less intelligent than you just because they don't write the same way.

[Teeny Tiny Cat]

Needlessly repetitive post, mods feel free to delete.

[ℕ Hilbert-WARing Theorem™]

Because english wasn't my first language doesn't make me inferior to you.

 

I never said or implied that. English wasn't my first language either, I was born in a non-English speaking country. Thus, I am sympathetic with what you are saying. However, many ideas do require a certain level of familiarity with the English language, which is why English is so important. You are not inferior, but clearly there is a difference in ability of communication between a native speaker of English and someone who did not learn that English so early on.

[Дебра]

I never said or implied that.

 

Yes you did lmao do you even understand the words you are typing?

lowest common denominator

In relation to people, they are the simplest group in a population. They have the simplest opinions, the simplest views and the simplest lifestyles. They are the unsophisticated (which is not correlated to the amount of happiness they have - in fact, living a simple life may make you even more happy than living a sophisticated one). Because these people do not think as much as a sophisticated person, they tend to be more naive and more gullible to gut feelings, and the ingrained culture and social laws that are around them. Their trust is easily earned.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Lowest+Common+Denominator

[Teeny Tiny Cat]

I never said or implied that. English wasn't my first language either, I was born in a non-English speaking country. Thus, I am sympathetic with what you are saying. However, many ideas do require a certain level of familiarity with the English language, which is why English is so important. You are not inferior, but clearly there is a difference in ability of communication between a native speaker of English and someone who did not learn that English so early on.

 

No, there isn't. You can communicate perfectly easily with non-native speakers, you choose to make your posts needlessly verbose and have admitted as much.

[ℕ Hilbert-WARing Theorem™]

No, there isn't. You can communicate perfectly easily with non-native speakers, you choose to make your posts needlessly verbose and have admitted as much.

 

I agree that there is no difference in terms of communication with non-native speakers, assuming that there are interpretative resources. My claim was that, in an almost-uniformly English forum, somebody who did not learn English as a native language will have difficulties in manipulating and understanding the English language. This was true for myself, initially, when I was still in elementary school. It was slightly more difficult for me to understand ordinary conversations in English. This was not due to necessarily a disability with understanding ideas, it was a language barrier.

[t0night]

i don't understand where this non-native english speaker stuff is coming into it from, but it's irrelevant in my view. your obsession with completely unecessary polysyllabic constructions is, to be frank, just annoying to read. it adds absolutely nothing to your pragmatic meaning and adds a bunch of judgement onto everything you write.

 

if you believe you think in that vocabulary it is because you have trained yourself to, which amounts to much the same thing only the writing is on your psyche not your computer screen.

 

just look at your signature and tell me you're not trying hard to appear incredibly clever.

[Teeny Tiny Cat]

I agree that there is no difference in terms of communication with non-native speakers, assuming that there are interpretative resources. My claim was that, in an almost-uniformly English forum, somebody who did not learn English as a native language will have difficulties in manipulating and understanding the English language.

 

They manage fine the rest of the time.

[ℕ Hilbert-WARing Theorem™]

i don't understand where this non-native english speaker stuff is coming into it from, but it's irrelevant in my view. your obsession with completely unecessary polysyllabic constructions is, to be frank, just annoying to read. it adds absolutely nothing to your pragmatic meaning and adds a bunch of judgement onto everything you write.

 

if you believe you think in that vocabulary it is because you have trained yourself to, which amounts to much the same thing only the writing is on your psyche not your computer screen.

 

just look at your signature and tell me you're not trying hard to appear incredibly clever.

 

Well, it is mostly a reflection of my interest in mathematics. The mathematics is not all that complicated, although it is profoundly influential in the field of mathematics to some limited extent. Those who are proficient in mathematics will immediately recognize that the equations are not famously difficult to solve, they are simply not that common. These particular equations are even relatively popular and I would not be surprised if someone were to tell me what they were.

[Дебра]

Well, it is mostly a reflection of my interest in mathematics. The mathematics is not all that complicated, although it is profoundly influential in the field of mathematics to some limited extent. Those who are proficient in mathematics will immediately recognize that the equations are not famously difficult to solve, they are simply not that common.

 

where does math come into this?

[t0night]

Well, it is mostly a reflection of my interest in mathematics. The mathematics is not all that complicated, although it is profoundly influential in the field of mathematics to some limited extent. Those who are proficient in mathematics will immediately recognize that the equations are not famously difficult to solve, they are simply not that common. These particular equations are even relatively popular and I would not be surprised if someone were to tell me what they were.

your personality seems entirely comprised of things that look complex but in reality aren't. sig and content all fit the bill. and the name.

 

that's what initially makes me cringe a bit. it's the combination. you're projecting this 'i like maths and i sound clever' thing so hard you actually sound devoid of character. if that's too close to the bone i apologise but i've just realised what it is about it that makes me uncomfortable.

[polar]

The point of language is to communicate clearly. In most situations, bulletted phrases are easier to understand then paragraphs due to the limit of a person's attention span. In fact, the OP has two different sentences that are four lines long. That's a no-no in just about every writing class I have ever taken. The human mind fatigues after more than three phrases. 

 

Write simply, clearly, and without so many grammatical or spelling errors, and communication is at its best. Verbosity obfuscates.

[AFFIRMATIVE]

Well, you should have some background. I mostly write for an academic purpose and do not use the forums that frequently. On more academic forums, this type of language would be common-place, although of course there would be variation in language complexity. I am not trying to impress anybody in particular, this is simply the language style I have learned and adopted through my academic conditioning. I falsely assumed that many of these users would agree with my use of language. It was not to cause any kind of upset.

 

You have this excessive use of synonyms that makes your statement sound more important than it actually is. You are aware of the contents of this forum yet you still have this consistent professional attitude which makes you sound condescending.

 

You need to learn to adapt your linguistics because there will be a lot of people that will see your statement not inaccurate, but very artificial. Sometimes you don't need to sound only correct when you talk to someone, you need to also sound genuine.

[sulker]

hey guys, plz don’t think I’m a nerd just because of that screwed up title XDDDD

 

In backpack.tf forums, u dont need to speak real complicated stuff with hard words.  I noe that using long words could actually make me sound like a spazz, but screw it, I still love my thesaurus LOL

 

Everyone here knows that U dont have to use long words for people to get the point.  But If your like me, I wanna get the point across and if Im thinking with longer words that you dont get, well, you suck XD

 

In minecraft forums which i go on to a lot, loads of people are all MLG PRO and FAZE CLAN and 420 NOSCOPE BL4Z31T, but I wanna make this place a place where clever people like me are not discriminated against.  

 

tHanks for reading, I appreciate ur feedback

 

FTFY

[t0night]

The point of language is to communicate clearly.

i know this is a much larger and different topic but i can't let that one slide

 

ascribing a specific point to language misses the point of the incredible flexibility it has. sure, evolutionarily the main advantage of it is communication between individuals. but we also think in language. language shapes our perceptions, our politics, our psychology, in ways that escape the boundaries of pure communication.

 

i also hate phrases like 'never use a long word where a short one will do' because at its worst, it shreds meaning in the name of clarifying it.

[BlaqkAudio]

Ever heard of KISS? (not the rock band)

 

I heard it's very effective.

[Angelcake]

My god this guy

[fluffyy]

what does this have to do with politics, religion, and science?

[ℕ Hilbert-WARing Theorem™]

Thank you for your valuable insights and comments. While there have been some non-contributory remarks, that is to be expected in such a forum. This discussion was mostly to serve as a sounding board for the linguistic expectations on the forum. I am not a frequent forum user, so it was somewhat of a process of becoming more familiar with the forum culture. Be concise, be clear, do not use too many words to describe a simple idea. All very good points to take note of. Many speakers on these forums are not natively English speakers and it would not be very constructive to be very verbose in any case. Using too many words will take away from your point, rather than to help you get your message across. This was the main idea behind the responses and it is very reasonable. For now, continue to discuss, but I have taken away a good lesson from what I have learned here.

[ℕ Hilbert-WARing Theorem™]

what does this have to do with politics, religion, and science?

 

It is more of a social science question that is specific to this forum. It is moderately scientific in that it asks about the forum perception of language complexity and its tolerance towards such complexity.

[Jams]

Here's just how it goes, when you're on the internet: expect no grammar, expect no respect, expect no craps given. Most of people who use these forums could care less about what some random person says. Trying to sound smart to us forumers is like talking to a brick wall. It doesn't listen, and it doesn't care.

[.Dusk]

how i see it: humans invented language to communicate a lot more easily, as long as you get your point across i could care less how you word it.

"linguistic complexity" isnt needed on a TF2 Trading Forums website.

[Teeny Tiny Cat]

Thank you for your valuable insights and comments. While there have been some non-contributory remarks, that is to be expected in such a forum. This discussion was mostly to serve as a sounding board for the linguistic expectations on the forum. I am not a frequent forum user, so it was somewhat of a process of becoming more familiar with the forum culture. Be concise, be clear, do not use too many words to describe a simple idea. All very good points to take note of. Many speakers on these forums are not natively English speakers and it would not be very constructive to be very verbose in any case. Using too many words will take away from your point, rather than to help you get your message across. This was the main idea behind the responses and it is very reasonable. For now, continue to discuss, but I have taken away a good lesson from what I have learned here.

 

This is all advice I would encourage you to apply in general, not just on this forum.

 

Once again, your tone suggests that you think the users of this forum are somehow simpler or unable to rise to your level of discussion because they don't speak english well enough, but again, that is rather classist and borderline racist. They are not less intelligent than you just because they express their ideas in a different way. I know you are not flat out saying that they are, but you need to be aware of the impression you may give to people without realising.

[puddingkip]

You don't need perfect English to participate in these forums. Some of the top contributors both in quality and in quantity are not fluent. Even a lot of members of our team are not native apeakers, although we all can communicate in English my own skill level isn't the best and I'd like to improve it quite a bit.

 

All speaking with really fancy words and expressions really does is make you come across like a pedantic narcissistic snob

 

This is all advice I would encourage you to apply in general, not just on this forum.

 

Once again, your tone suggests that you think the users of this forum are somehow simpler or unable to rise to your level of discussion because they don't speak english well enough, but again, that is rather classist and borderline racist. They are not less intelligent than you just because they express their ideas in a different way. I know you are not flat out saying that they are, but you need to be aware of the impression you may give to people without realising.

Yes this. I would like to see some of the elitist native speakers I've met in my time on the internet converse in Russian, Spanish, Dutch or any other language. Being better than a foreigner at your own tongue is not really an impressive feat in my opinion