Charity Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 Why does everyone hate him for doing the former, but love those that do the latter? Because paying VERY little for games as part of a charity bundle just to sell to make yourself profit seems fairly greedy, rather than buying games on sale for a set price in the Valve store. He donated, I know, but something about making profit off of your donations seems wrong. There's a very distinct difference between buying games in the store and buying them as a part of a charity bundle, not to mention it goes against the rules of the bundle itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toceus Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 Because paying VERY little for games as part of a charity bundle just to sell to make yourself profit seems fairly greedy, rather than buying games on sale for a set price in the Valve store. He donated, I know, but something about making profit off of your donations seems wrong. There's a very distinct difference between buying games in the store and buying them as a part of a charity bundle, not to mention it goes against the rules of the bundle itself. There really isn't. Money goes to the developers either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wub Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 If he didnt want to play the games why didnt he just donate normally? Like Charity said, it seems like a dick move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knavesmith Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 There really isn't. Money goes to the developers either way.How would you like it if you were raking in pennies a day on something you worked hard for when someone else is making hundreds by reselling that same thing for well over what you're asking for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toceus Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 How would you like it if you were raking in pennies a day on something you worked hard for when someone else is making hundreds by reselling that same thing for well over what you're asking for? If they wanted to buy games @ $20, they would have bought the bundle. As it stands, they didn't, so they resort to buying the bundle from someone else, at a profit to the reseller - basically paying them for the service of holding the bundle for them until they could pay for it / play for it. Chances are, had the reseller not existed, the person that wanted to buy those games wouldn't have bought them at all because of them being too expensive on the store (keep in mind that people that can afford store games will buy them outright for the convenience). This basically means that, thanks to bundle resellers, the game developer gets something instead of nothing. I also want to turn your attention to the fact that you won't get steam keys unless you donate $1 or above for the first 3 games / $7.65 or above for the next 3 games / $20 or above for BioShock: Infinite and XCOM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco Blaze Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 If they wanted to buy games @ $20, they would have bought the bundle. As it stands, they didn't, so they resort to buying the bundle from someone else, at a profit to the reseller - basically paying them for the service of holding the bundle for them until they could pay for it / play for it. Chances are, had the reseller not existed, the person that wanted to buy those games wouldn't have bought them at all because of them being too expensive on the store (keep in mind that people that can afford store games will buy them outright for the convenience). This basically means that, thanks to bundle resellers, the game developer gets something instead of nothing. I also want to turn your attention to the fact that you won't get steam keys unless you donate $1 or above for the first 3 games / $7.65 or above for the next 3 games / $20 or above for BioShock: Infinite and XCOM. And I would like to point out to you that he is only selling the first part of the bundle. The $1 part. If you could afford to buy it from him, you could more than likely sell your items for paypal and get it yourself. His $1 donation is great and all, but paying $1 to visit a gold mine just to steal the gold is horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knavesmith Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 If they wanted to buy games @ $20, they would have bought the bundle. As it stands, they didn't, so they resort to buying the bundle from someone else, at a profit to the reseller - basically paying them for the service of holding the bundle for them until they could pay for it / play for it. Chances are, had the reseller not existed, the person that wanted to buy those games wouldn't have bought them at all because of them being too expensive on the store (keep in mind that people that can afford store games will buy them outright for the convenience). This basically means that, thanks to bundle resellers, the game developer gets something instead of nothing. That is not what I meant at all. The resellers are the ones buying your item for way less than you could be making and reselling them for as much as you could be making off said item, leaving you with spare change and the reseller with enough money to keep on buying. Sure you make SOMETHING, but wouldn't you feel cheated when someone else is making more off of what YOU created? I also want to turn your attention to the fact that you won't get steam keys unless you donate $1 or above for the first 3 games / $7.65 or above for the next 3 games / $20 or above for BioShock: Infinite and XCOM.Irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco Blaze Posted July 9, 2014 Share Posted July 9, 2014 Also, take a look at his post. He bought these with the intention of reselling. It is one thing for a person to approach you and ask for you to buy the bundle for them with some form of compensation. It is something else entirely to buy the bundle just to gut it for profit and no intended personal or gift use prior to purchase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toceus Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 > And I would like to point out to you that he is only selling the first part of the bundle. The $1 part. If you could afford to buy it from him, you could more than likely sell your items for paypal and get it yourself. So then no one would be buying from him and this whole thread is pointless. If, according to you, anyone that wants the games would buy them for $1, what's the difference between him buying it or someone else buying it? I'll answer - he's supplying a service of convenience, trading the games for ref, instead of PayPal which many might not have, and so his profit is just him being paid for the service. > The resellers are the ones buying your item for way less than you could be making and reselling them for as much as you could be making off said item, leaving you with spare change and the reseller with enough money to keep on buying. In a market economy of virtual goods, you're only allowed to have one price for one item at a time - there's never any reason to pick the more expensive one. As a game developer, the cost of actually distributing your game online is close to 0 (if peer-to-peer). Developers therefore try to appeal to as large a percentage of the population as possible with their prices, and steam sales + humble bundles give you the option of selling it to more people. Think of it this way. There's rich people, medium people, and poor people. Rich people = buy games from the store @ $30, don't care about game trading because they pay for convenience of the store. Medium people = trade for game gifts for past sales that were sold for $15, don't care about CD keys because they don't want to deal with rep and all that. Poor people = trade for bundles that were sold for $1 because that's all they can afford. If game developers never had humble bundles or sales, they would lose a lot of profit from cutting out the chunks of population that can't pay for the games. Humble bundle resellers are doing the same thing, with the same ethical consequences, as game gift traders. They are essentially doing the service of holding games for those sections of the poor populace that were not available to purchase the bundle when it was on. For the developer, receiving $1 is infinite times better than receiving $0, because the humble bundle reseller's target market is the people that can't afford the game any other way. If the reseller buys too many copies of the humble bundle, they go unused, and what happens in the end? The game developer got a couple extra bucks for games that never got activated. If the reseller buys too few copies, those that could have given the devs $1 instead give them $0 as they are unable to afford the game. This is basic-ish virtual economics. > Irrelevant. I thought you meant the "pennies" thing literally, as in, the guy's buying all these games for 3 cents. > It is one thing for a person to approach you and ask for you to buy the bundle for them with some form of compensation. It is something else entirely to buy the bundle just to gut it for profit and no intended personal or gift use prior to purchase. It is actually... the exact same thing. It's just that instead of directly receiving communications from the resell-ee beforehand, the reseller guesses that he will want to buy this at a later date. In both cases, the outcome is the same: - Devs are paid $1 - Reseller makes 30 cents from the service he supplies - Buyer gets a game he wouldn't have otherwise afforded. Everyone in this thread needs to be more pragmatic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charity Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 > It is one thing for a person to approach you and ask for you to buy the bundle for them with some form of compensation. It is something else entirely to buy the bundle just to gut it for profit and no intended personal or gift use prior to purchase. It is actually... the exact same thing. It's just that instead of directly receiving communications from the resell-ee beforehand, the reseller guesses that he will want to buy this at a later date. You're missing the point entirely. He was talking about morals, not business opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wub Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Its for charity, not for profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toceus Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 You're missing the point entirely. He was talking about morals, not business opportunity. Do you find exchange to be moral? Do you find that it's better for the developer to have $1, and the gamer to have a game, or for both to have neither? Morals are really irrelevant - intentions don't really matter, so long as the end result is the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toceus Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Its for charity, not for profit. Charity... which goes to the developers of the games being sold... hmm... and this money feeds those developers... so it's basically revenue... and when revenue is higher than expenses, it becomes a profit... (2/3rds of the money goes to 2k games) You're just randomly stating words, not arguments, and this phrase you must've repeated 2-3 times before now is just getting ridiculous to hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambro Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Fucking shit people, let the guy sell his games after he bought em. It feels like every single goddamn thread is becoming a warzone. Yes, selling these games after he bought them seems like a deceptive move, but anyone with half a fucking brain is gonna know he's selling Humble Bundle games if he says "Theyre codes btw". So fucking lay off this guy. Not to mention he may just want to turn some money into metal, he's making, how much, like 3 cents profit? tl;dr: Quitcherbitchin and let him sell his damn games. The only thing wrong about this thread is that its in the general discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shpiro Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Morals are really irrelevant - intentions don't really matter, so long as the end result is the same. So say you shoot some guy because you don't like his hair. I shoot someone else because he's trying to kill my family. Same thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toceus Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 So say you shoot some guy because you don't like his hair. I shoot someone else because he's trying to kill my family. Same thing? ??? End results are totally different. In one case, some innocent guy with a family gets brutally killed, in another, a criminal about to kill a family gets killed in self-defence. What I mean is: You shoot a guy because he's going to kill your family vs I shoot a guy that's about to kill your family because he has bad hair in this case the end results are the exact same. a family gets saved. even though there were differing intentions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqkAudio Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 ??? End results are totally different. In one case, some innocent guy with a family gets brutally killed, in another, a criminal about to kill a family gets killed in self-defence. What I mean is: You shoot a guy because he's going to kill your family vs I shoot a guy that's about to kill your family because he has bad hair in this case the end results are the exact same. a family gets saved. even though there were differing intentions. One of the guys that get shot wasn't trying to kill any family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toceus Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 One of the guys that get shot wasn't trying to kill any family So then the end results aren't the same at all. You're not disproving any argument, you're just proving you can't read previous posts. To clarify the original counter-argument: there is no difference between - a reseller guesses that there is demand for a game, buys it for $1, receives 30c of profit for reselling it, and a customer gets the game - someone is asked to buy a game for a friend he knows, buys it for $1, receives 30c as a gift for doing this, and the friend gets the game why: because the dev gets $1, the reseller/someone gets 30 cents of profit, the poor guy gets a game also known as: the end results are the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleverpun Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Locking for off-topic/flame war/soapboxing/wrong forum/other stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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