Middleman fee?

[CocoaNut]

I'm thinking about getting involved in the unusual trade in a few months and I'm wondering: Do middlemen generally charge a fee? If so, how much?

[_Blaze_]

i don't think they have fees

but they take tips

[Liddojunior]

They don't/won't charge you. The reason why they are there is to help. 

 

But to give them tips for their time would be a good thing, and if the trades are large and take up time than giving them bigger tips would be something you should do. 

[UGUF Molotov]

Tips, only. 
If you think you're going to make profit being a middleman, get out.
It will help solidify your rep, and promote a safer trading community.
If you're middlemanning for coin, you're doing it all wrong, and no one should have any reason to trust you.

[Teeird]

Since the start I always believed Middlemen should be paid for their services. Reputation isn't something easily gained, so it has value. Getting paid is an incentive for middlemen to be more active, and to not go rogue. Everyone wins.

[UGUF Molotov]

Since the start I always believed Middlemen should be paid for their services. Reputation isn't something easily gained, so it has value. Getting paid is an incentive for middlemen to be more active, and to not go rogue. Everyone wins.

If payment is the thing keeping you from going rogue, why are we even considering you for middleman positions in the first place?.

If middlemen are in it for the profit, what's keeping them from turning to corruption when someone approaches them with a big payoff?

 

Reputation has value, as you stated. In the trading world, where our community is basically self-regulated, that reputation opens doors that having keys/buds alone won't open for you. 

No one is going to go first just because you have more pure in your backpack.

You can't buy rep. Rep is payment.

 

Tips are granted out of a need to support a middleman service not motivated by profit margins.

[Teeird]

If payment is the thing keeping you from going rogue, why are we even considering you for middleman positions in the first place?.

If middlemen are in it for the profit, what's keeping them from turning to corruption when someone approaches them with a big payoff?

 

 

You're looking at it the wrong way.

 

Someone wants your time. It's only fair to compensate the person for their time. Especially since both parties are using your reputation to finalize their transaction.

 

Look at the real world of economics, there's all sorts of different middlemen that exist to accomplish many different tasks. They don't wish for a tip or do it out the kindness of their heart. It's a by fee system. It's a job that has value, people will pay for safety.

[CocoaNut]

You're looking at it the wrong way.

 

Someone wants your time. It's only fair to compensate the person for their time. Especially since both parties are using your reputation to finalize their transaction.

 

Look at the real world of economics, there's all sorts of different middlemen that exist to accomplish many different tasks. They don't wish for a tip or do it out the kindness of their heart. It's a by fee system. It's a job that has value, people will pay for safety.

 

Which is pretty much how I operate my trades and how I view myself in them. I'm the guy that finds a buyer for other people's stuff so they don't have to. And I don't do it for free, either. I buy at a discounted rate and sell at a higher price.

 

 

Tips, only. 

If you think you're going to make profit being a middleman, get out.

It will help solidify your rep, and promote a safer trading community.

If you're middlemanning for coin, you're doing it all wrong, and no one should have any reason to trust you.

 

You might want to read my post again. I'm not looking to be a middleman. I'm looking to pay a middleman. Not right now, though. I'm just trying to ascertain some prospects.

 

In any case, I would most certainly tip any middleman I used. What would be a good tip, and, as I have someone in mind that I'm hoping to use as a middleman that does not currently have any rep (someone that I trust absolutely), is there anything she or I could do to help convince any trader looking to buy something from me that she's legitimate?

[UGUF Molotov]

You're looking at it the wrong way.

 

Someone wants your time. It's only fair to compensate the person for their time. Especially since both parties are using your reputation to finalize their transaction.

 

Look at the real world of economics, there's all sorts of different middlemen that exist to accomplish many different tasks. They don't wish for a tip or do it out the kindness of their heart. It's a by fee system. It's a job that has value, people will pay for safety.

In real world economics, middlemanning does not exist.

Real world economics use non grey market currencies, aka legitimate internationally recognized currency.

The only reason for a middlman is to trade your grey market valued items for real world currency. (speculative crypto-currencies, not withstanding)

If regulators in the real world were responsible for this, you can guarantee it would not be a fee based system. It would be an independent organization where everyone chipped in equally for services rendered, to avoid conflict in interest.

 

You can't compare the two.

[UGUF Molotov]

You might want to read my post again. I'm not looking to be a middleman. I'm looking to pay a middleman. Not right now, though. I'm just trying to ascertain some prospects.

 

In any case, I would most certainly tip any middleman I used. What would be a good tip, and, as I have someone in mind that I'm hoping to use as a middleman that does not currently have any rep (someone that I trust absolutely), is there anything she or I could do to help convince any trader looking to buy something from me that she's legitimate?

 

My bad.

As for tip amount, when I used middleman services, long before becoming fully proficient in background checking, and far less tf2 wealthy, I had a base rate of half a key for a successful unusual trade, or scam prevention.

I would of course adjust if there were issues, it took time, etc.

It's really about what you can afford, and any middleman that wants to pressure you into paying more than what you want should not be a middleman in the first place.

 

[CocoaNut]

My bad.

As for tip amount, when I used middleman services, long before becoming fully proficient in background checking, and far less tf2 wealthy, I had a base rate of half a key for a successful unusual trade, or scam prevention.

I would of course adjust if there were issues, it took time, etc.

It's really about what you can afford, and any middleman that wants to pressure you into paying more than what you want should not be a middleman in the first place.

 

 

Ew. Half a key? I was thinking percentage-based.

 

I tip poker dealers more for a winning hand than half a key.

[UGUF Molotov]

It's not based off percentage.
it's based off what the person can afford to toss your way.

Again, middlemanning is not a "for profit" pursuit.
A tip is just so they can get some compensation for their time.

Also, middlemen are really only useful to new traders, people with very little backpack, trading low tier unusuals.
Higher tier traders know what a suspicious profile is, what the common scams are, or just deal with reputable traders exclusively, and have no use for middleman traders.

You are not going to get 10% of a 10 bud hat.
No one that has traded their way up for long enough to get their dream unusual really has any use for a middleman.

Again, these services are available for the greater community to promote safe trading, and keep you from getting scammed.
They are only vital, so far as you are not experienced enough to determine who is and isn't trustworthy, yourself.

Half a key to tell someone that an account is legit or suspicious, then hold onto something for someone else, is more than fair, if you're just moving something worth a bud.
As I mentioned above, add more if for some reason it took longer, there were issues, or you required more out of your middleman than a clean run middlemanning, but even with a more expansive backpack, and plenty of pure, I have a hard time justifying more than a full key, MAXIMUM, if i'm buying a 1 bud hat, for a service, any experienced trade friend could help me out with, for free, without the boost in their online rep.

[Slocumruls]

In real world economics, middlemanning does not exist.

Real world economics use non grey market currencies, aka legitimate internationally recognized currency.

The only reason for a middlman is to trade your grey market valued items for real world currency. (speculative crypto-currencies, not withstanding)

If regulators in the real world were responsible for this, you can guarantee it would not be a fee based system. It would be an independent organization where everyone chipped in equally for services rendered, to avoid conflict in interest.

 

You can't compare the two.

In the real world middlemen most definitely exist for a variety of reasons. Stock brokers are the most high profile of such middle men who are paid because of their position within the stock exchanges. However, there are also middlemen involved in many other areas both legal and illegal that are purely there because of the "doors" that are opened because of their reputation and status (Diamonds, Guns, and Drugs are a few primary examples I can think of where reputation is pretty much required to facilitate high level deals).

[UGUF Molotov]

In the real world middlemen most definitely exist for a variety of reasons. Stock brokers are the most high profile of such middle men who are paid because of their position within the stock exchanges. However, there are also middlemen involved in many other areas both legal and illegal that are purely there because of the "doors" that are opened because of their reputation and status (Diamonds, Guns, and Drugs are a few primary examples I can think of where reputation is pretty much required to facilitate high level deals).

Again, this middlemanning is not the same as middlemanning between real world currency and virtual currency, in comparison to our legal markets.

The entire function of what the middleman does is in no way comparable.  Facilitating an account's financial trades nets you a brokerage fee.

You are being paid for divesting in one market's product and reinvesting in another. You ARE doing the work, and the portfolio is under your management(Source: My work history involves trading stocks).

Also as for middlemanning black markets, you are absolutely correct, due to the anonymity of the black market, vetted middlemen are going to always be in high demand, however, like stated above, middlemanning out of a profit motive almost certainly guarantees that middlemen WILL turn on their clients at some point.  The turnaround on a reputable black market middleman is ridiculously high. Vetted middlemen, that an entry level inductee to the black market would have access to, only stay legit in the black market for a while, and middleman services that protect against such actions, do so as private firms, where they leverage the collective interest against an individuals' willingness to "go rogue." Something we have no ability to do, as we are not all part of the same criminal organization, and we do not have private investors.

Comparing apples to oranges here. Even though the term middleman is used in all three places, the function of the middleman is drastically different, and not the same job, whatsoever.

I meant to put, in my original post, "middlemanning does not exist in real world finance, the way it does in virtual markets."

Virtual item middlemanning is unique to gaming communities, or communities using virtual items/currency.

It is not new, and it will not die when it ceases to continue in TF2, either.

The unique aspect of this particular middlemanning setup is that it becomes less necessary the longer and more experienced and invested one becomes, as opposed to becoming more necessary, as the other markets would require.