base64's Blog

Those saying that the "supply" of Keys is "unlimited" will not understand those graphs either.

But I guess it would also help all others (without an economics degree) if there was an explanation for the different lines and how to read the graph.

Well the supply is unlimited.  I'm pretty sure Mann Co will sell me as many damn keys as I wish to buy.

Well the supply is unlimited.  I'm pretty sure Mann Co will sell me as many damn keys as I wish to buy.

At a specific price of $2.49. 

 

A seller who is willing to sell unlimited quantity at a specific price does not mean that quantity transacted is unlimited. 

 

Demand is the quantity you are willing and able to buy at different prices, and the intersection of the "unlimited supply at specific price" and "downward sloping demand" is the final quantity transacted. What you wish to buy is completely irrelevant. What you did and can buy is relevant. 

 

The logic that kids employ on this site is this: 

https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Abackpack.tf+mann+co+supply+is+unlimited&oq=site%3Abackpack.tf+mann+co+supply+is+unlimited

The problem that makes this hard to understand is the fact that there is a primary and secondary market.

The primary market is a monopoly with a different currency (that is not really exchangeable) used than in the competitive secondary market.

There is no such thing as a monopoly supply curve. Perfect competition is the only market structure for which a supply function can be derived.

To make things worse, they are not independent.

The Community Market and secondary market have no effect on the price / supply of the only true source of Keys, the primary market, only an effect on the demand there.

And that demand in turn is where possible supply for the secondary market originates.

 

One could argue that the supply,

the amount of some product producers are willing and able to sell at a given price all other factors being held constant

, in the primary market is indeed practically unlimited, as can also be seen in the first graph that the "supply curve" for the given price is a horizontal line, having no limit for the quantity willing and able to sell.

 

But when we talk about the "price" of Keys and the available "supply" where the controversy lies, we are talking about the price in terms of Metal in the secondary market.

 

And supply is obviously not unlimited there.

 

Only if you could craft a Key with Metal, the supply would be practically unlimited for a given price, the cost to craft.

Or if Value would buy back unlimited amounts of Metal from each individual at a fixed price in Wallet money for which you could buy Keys in the primary market again to serve as supply in the secondary market.

 

But there is an upper bound for the Key price in terms of metal, determined by the cost (incl. price, fees, access, convenience, ...) to convert Metal into Wallet money to buy Keys from the primary Market instead of directly buying for Metal in the secondary market.

 

But that upper bound does not equate to an "unlimited supply" in the secondary market, as you (acting as a supplier) only have a limited ability to exploit that for supply purposes and thus are not able to sell in unlimited quantities.

 

As long as the Key price in terms of Metal rises, that upper boundary has not been reached yet. And it is not fixed either, as the fictitious Metal price in terms of Wallet money changes.

 

Another issue is, that Mann Co. and Steam Store prices are not the same across the globe (after currency conversion).

 

Bottom line, the whole Key - Metal - Mann Co. - Community Market - price - supply / demand issue is very complex and cannot easily be explained with a few words or a simple graph.

The supply of keys is unlimited. it is only the price that is regulated by an external source, The most important line that is missing on those graphs is the number of kids with access to credit cards or steam gift cards.

 

The argument of primary and secondary markets is irrelvant for the following:reason:

keys open crates,

For as long as crates drop in the servers during play time then keys will be sold.

if you want to see if the market in keys is controlled find out how many crates dropped per week for a given period then find out how many were deleted & opened and take that from the number of keys sold. If the number of keys exceeds the number of existing crates (not being collected for completeness) then there is an unlimited supply of them

 

try trading refined metal for a set of buds or a god tier unusual & see how far you get.

 

The market is flooded with millions of free craftable items a week. a lot of those get turned into metal via crafting that leads to more metal .... more metal leads to more trades. more metal leads to an increase in price of keys or a devaluation of the metal, which ever you prefer. but the supply is unlimited.

 

The day you can "craft" a key is the day that tf2 trading stops.

 

your question should be "is the demand for keys unlimited" .......

The supply of keys is unlimited. [...]

Sorry, you missed it completely.

The supply of keys is unlimited. [...]

 

I don't even...

The supply of keys is unlimited. [...]

 

None of your points are correct. Please read Uranium235's response again. 

I think the supply of keys is unlimited, Valve can pull as many they want out of their Gaben's ass.

There is never an unlimited amount of something. Anything and everything is scarce. Just because the keys are available from the Mann Co store does not mean that buyers will continue buying. Just because people idle for metal does NOT mean that there is an unlimited source of metal going to them. They are producing metal just as key buyers are pumping keys into the mannconomy. Just remember everything is scarce, even in the virtual world.

There is never an unlimited amount of something. Anything and everything is scarce. Just because the keys are available from the Mann Co store does not mean that buyers will continue buying. Just because people idle for metal does NOT mean that there is an unlimited source of metal going to them. They are producing metal just as key buyers are pumping keys into the mannconomy. Just remember everything is scarce, even in the virtual world.

 

Finite amount of time, eh? And light?

Finite amount of time, eh? And light?

 

 

Concerning time, we don't know yet. Concerning light, that is finite, at least in our observable universe, otherwise we don't know yet either.