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Loose Cannon vs. Stock.


Hatrix

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I like loose.

 

That is all

 

Nah the loose can be really good and do a lot of damage because u can knock them back, which hurts them but then also the bomb explodes and kills them, for a scout it can be 1 hit if on target

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The most obvious is the ability to spam.

 

You really can't spam the Loose Cannon and expect it to do much, whereas you can easily spam with the stock and get some sick roller kills or damage numbers and while people who play in pubs will be all like "adwjojodojppwonppohfw bad spam demloman" it's a viable thing to do when trying to hold a choke in 5CP or KoTH.

 

The Loose Cannon is fairly nice at getting the damage, with double donks doing something like 144 they can make killing Medics quite easy assuming they have bad positioning in the first place, as well as making it easier to deal with smaller classes like the Scooty-Booty man. The knockback can be nice at times but more times than not if it isn't a double donk that knockback won't really get you anywhere.

 

The Grenade Launcher as mentioned before is great for it's spamability, which really is a big part of Demoman, plus not having to worry about that fuse makes hitting long-range targets much easier. You're also given a more reliable damage output with the average direct doing ~100 damage which is what you're going to working with more times than not, rollers do on average the same amount of damage that a direct hit from the Loose does, maybe more or less as I haven't looked at the numbers in a while so in some respects you have a higher and more reliable damage output with the stocky stock over the LooseyGoosey.

 

Overall they both have their pros and cons, even though I don't think I really went into the cons on either but whatever.

They're highly situation in which one is the superior weapon as well as being based on the user at the time.

 

I vote for the stock personally.

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Loose cannon is extremely versatile and with good practice can be absolutely amazing. It's way easier and more effective to blast jump with it. The double donk is extremely powerful and can result in 1 hit kills.

On the other hand the stock is easier to use and rollers can be useful.

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The Grenade Launcher as mentioned before is great for it's spamability, which really is a big part of Demoman, plus not having to worry about that fuse makes hitting long-range targets much easier. You're also given a more reliable damage output with the average direct doing ~100 damage which is what you're going to working with more times than not, rollers do on average the same amount of damage that a direct hit from the Loose does, maybe more or less as I haven't looked at the numbers in a while so in some respects you have a higher and more reliable damage output with the stocky stock over the LooseyGoosey.

Demoman's job isn't spam though, it's area denial. Spam does go hand-in-hand with area denial, but overall I find the Loose Cannon to be more useful for area denial. You can even shut down ubers just by pushing them back with the Cannon, I did that several times today in the HL scrim I was in. The Loose Cannon is better for utility and area denial in my opinion. It doesn't have the same potential for rollers but if you can double donk, it's much more useful.

 

Loose Cannon's also good for retreats as you can push people away from you. You try that with stock, you'll kill yourself if they're close enough.

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stock because I've never put time into learning the loose cannon and I dont feel like I need to improve

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LC is annoying because you can spam it and get an über drop on gully wash (sure some of you will understand this reference). I hate everyone who uses it in 6v6 games. In pubs it's fine but I like stock.

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I prefer the Loose Cannon because whenever I get a double donk I get a half chub. The sound is just so..... rewarding. I do swap between both from time to time, both have advantages and disadvantages.

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I'd go for loose cannon

On top of its ridiculous ability to blast targets skyhigh with knockback, the controlled fuse on the lc gives you the ability to fight scouts with less hassle and allows you to cannon jump. When paired with the chargin targe, it can negate the self damage and allow extreme mobility.

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I would use the loose cannon, but I have this weird glitch where when i am reloading, the loose cannon will charge its shot and it will blow up in my face. Sorry for actually asking a question on someone else's thread, but could someone help me with this?

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Double Donks make me feel tingly

I prefer the Loose Cannon because whenever I get a double donk I get a half chub. The sound is just so..... rewarding.

Yeah, doubledonk sound is nice, not what I'm trying to compare.

 

Overall I find the utility of the Loose Cannon makes up for the less direct damage of the stock, you're playing area denial when playing Demo, it's easier to deny an area when your enemies are A: knocked back when they try to proceed, B: afraid of the doubledonk burst damage, and C: knocked the fuck back even when ubered. A few well-placed LC shots can deny the combo the entire eight seconds of their uber and waste it. Plus if you get caught near an uber, instead of being a sitting duck, you can knock them away, creating that breathing room to get away and hopefully separate the combo. If you're rocking stock next to an uber pop, you're pretty fucked. The only disadvantage I can think of is certain sentry placements where the stock would be better to take it out, but even so, LC spam at max distance can easily doubledonk the engi in one go, then your team can work the sentry down easily.

 

Plus the whole "scout counter isn't a death sentence" thing with the LC gives me a raging hard-on.

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It can one hit the lesser health classes in one hit with a double donk.

but then that's not a double donk, that's a single donk

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Since you will be pairing it up with the stickybomb launcher, the primary would be your close range defense weapon. The stock gives you a high rate of fire and reliable damage while the loose cannon relies on a lot of timing and it doesn't even have reliable damage. Personally I'd go for stock because of its constant 100 damage.

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Posted · Hidden by Mr. Bucket, August 31, 2015 - calling someone "a little shit"
Hidden by Mr. Bucket, August 31, 2015 - calling someone "a little shit"

but then that's not a double donk, that's a single donk

Yeah good for you, stop being a little shit, you've contributed nothing to the thread itself except trying to make your epeen bigger by raising your post count.

 

Since you will be pairing it up with the stickybomb launcher, the primary would be your close range defense weapon. The stock gives you a high rate of fire and reliable damage while the loose cannon relies on a lot of timing and it doesn't even have reliable damage. Personally I'd go for stock because of its constant 100 damage.

If your primary is a close range defense weapon though, wouldn't you want the one that doesn't blow up in your face and kill you? Stock doesn't have a higher rate of fire, both have the same rate if you tap m1 on the LC. If you can doubledonk consistently, the LC has incredibly reliable damage, but it depends on player skill moreso than how much spam you can put out. A well-placed LC shot can take people out quick, however a direct stock pill into a group would do more damage overall, as the doubledonk only affects one player at a time (iirc it can only hit one at a time). However the shock and awe factor of the LC can allow your team to take advantage of the other team's disorientation much easier.

 

I'll try using the stock over the next few days in pubs to see if there's any distinct advantage other than the higher average damage and better potency of the rollers, I feel as if any advantage the stock will have over the LC will be incredibly map and area specific, but who knows? We'll see.

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Alrighty so one huge thing I'm noticing right off the bat that's not mentioned so far in the stock vs. LC is that stock's projectile speed is much slower than the LC, making the LC the better choice if your target is running away or you just need that damage to hit the target faster.

 

Another tidbit, albeit a very very minor one, is that due to the stock's pill shape, rollers wobble somewhat unpredictably (especially on uneven terrain) as opposed to the LC's short life-span rollers that mostly just go straight once they hit the ground.

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Yeah good for you, stop being a little shit, you've contributed nothing to the thread itself except trying to make your epeen bigger by raising your post count.

Woah calm down. I'm not trying to increase my 'epeen' by raising my post count, in fact I don't see why I would waste my time pursing such a needless action. 

 

In fact, you replied to me. So obviously if I have a follow up I would say it, I don't use the loose cannon but I do know math and know that a double means twice. If you could prove it otherwise I would be grateful. Instead your here to throw accusations at me.

 

 

If your primary is a close range defense weapon though, wouldn't you want the one that doesn't blow up in your face and kill you?

What about close range with the loose cannon? And wouldn't you use your melee in this case?

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Woah calm down. I'm not trying to increase my 'epeen' by raising my post count, in fact I don't see why I would waste my time pursing such a needless action. 

In fact, you replied to me. So obviously if I have a follow up I would say it, I don't use the loose cannon but I do know math and know that a double means twice. If you could prove it otherwise I would be grateful. Instead your here to throw accusations at me.

Your original post was "wat". [sarcasm]Very helpful to the thread in the first place.[/sarcasm] I'm done addressing this.

 

What about close range with the loose cannon? And wouldn't you use your melee in this case?

Depends on the situation, if I'm in a position to knock the enemy to a sufficient distance for me to retreat, I'll use the LC. If I can corner the enemy, I'll usually melee him as I use the Skullcutter, the 20% damage boost ensures I can kill a lit target in one hit in most situations, but I'm not going to pull my melee out unless I know for a fact I'll get the one hit kill, because if I miss, they have that small time to counter, and assuming it's a class that uses hitscan weapons (e.g. scout, engi), one point blank meatshot would kill me. All in all, I'd rather knock them away and live to fight another day because once the Demo is dead on a team, it's harder to hold an area as you don't have that extra DPS and the discouragement of even the presence of stickies, let alone using them to trap people. Were I to have the stock in a situation where someone has already closed the distance and I am still running, a shot on them would most likely kill me. I'm not about to pull out my melee while backpedaling and start swinging, that's a definite death sentence.

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Your original post was "wat". [sarcasm]Very helpful to the thread in the first place.[/sarcasm] I'm done addressing this.

I was confused as to how you can get a double donk in 1 hit.

 

but I'm not going to pull my melee out unless I know for a fact I'll get the one hit kill, because if I miss, they have that small time to counter, and assuming it's a class that uses hitscan weapons (e.g. scout, engi), one point blank meatshot would kill me.

How do you miss a melee swing consistent enough for it to be a problem? You probably need something that has more melee range.

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I was confused as to how you can get a double donk in 1 hit.

 

How do you miss a melee swing consistent enough for it to be a problem? You probably need something that has more melee range.

>using skullcutter

I'm saying if I miss the one hit kill, they have the time to counter and that could be deadly, I'd rather play it safe and knock them away with the LC rather than risk the chance of melee.

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